Anyone using the "ShopBot Direct to Machine" postP?

[Gary Campbell]

Hopefully I am not the only one that has found or used the "direct to machine" post that comes with PWks v3. Since my machine does not have any of the OEM variables, I have a couple questions if you have used it.

1) Does the partsfile generated actaully go direct to the machine and run, as the name implies, or does it just automate the save/run task as it seems to on my machine?

2) Since I have used a good number of eCabs files that actually go directly to the machine similar to what Gcode version do, have you or do you wish to find a way to make it work ina similar fashion?

Thanks

[ted]

Hi Gary,

In conjunction with the new systems for the ShopBotEASY interface that is currently available as a beta. We have implemented the "Direct to Machine" (DTM) Option that you have just noted in PartWorks 3.0.

When the DTM option is used, PartWorks will save the .SBP file with the chosen name (as it normally would); and then will pass the file to ShopBot to run or preview depending on what mode ShopBot is in at the point you click "Save to File". This is a convenience feature, making using a routine cutting file more of a "click to print" type of automated process -- without the step of needing to separately load the toolpath into ShopBot. It does not prevent using the two step process if you prefer, just makes DTM an option when you finish toolpathing in PartWorks.

The feature only works in the posts included with the beta at the moment. Assuming everyone is comfortable with this approach, it will be included in the posts in the release version of 3.7.x.

Ted Hall, ShopBot Tools

PS. For those interested in testing the beta, it is availabe on the website and will run with both the ShopBotEASY interface and the standard interface -- you can switch back and forth.

[myxpykalix]

FYI- After reading this i wanted to check it out and this link:
http://www.shopbottools.com/files/Setup_sb3_7_1b11.exe is not working.
Oops!

The page you have requested can not be found. Some of our most popular pages are listed below for your convenience or use the search box to your left. You can also give us a call at 919-680-4800.

Just thought you might want to know...thanks for your hard work Ted!

[ken_rychlik]

Ted, A lot of folks using shopbots are not using Partworks. I am running v-carve and many users are running aspire.

Are there any plans to include these into the program or would we just be out of the loop?

[srwtlc]

Kenneth,

All you really need to do to make it work in Aspire/VCP is to modify your usual post processor that is in your user data folder by adding this line somewhere near the top (Right after UNITS = "inches" is good)...

DIRECT_OUTPUT = "DIRECT to ShopBot|ShopBot_run.ini"

You also need to put the ShopBot_run.ini file in the same PostP folder. That file is found in the C:\SbParts\PartWorksPosts folder. Just copy and paste.

Then just check the box for direct to machine when saving a toolpath in Aspire/VCP.

Scott

[Gary Campbell]

Kenneth....
Just got back from a day of "playing" with this and a couple other things I wanted to try. I have VCPro V6. I was able to take the posts from the Beta and install them into the UserDataFile for VCPro and use them. You will have to have VCPro V6 to have the "DTM" checkbox, I think.

All of my posts are modified and this new one was no exception. That is why I asked the original question. I was wondering if any of the unmodified posts gave different actions.

Edit: Scott... I didnt remember if the DTM box existed in earlier versions.

[knight_toolworks]

modifying the pp and the ini could you make it so when you save a toolpath it just copies it to the shopbot computer?

[ken_rychlik]

Thanks for the info Scott. I will give it a try.

An fyi for this option though. When using the shopbot link, if I let the link open SB3, it locks up looses position and crashes. If I open the SB3 first, the link will output to SB3 and it runs fine.

I am worried this will be the same way, but I am interested to see how it works.

[Gary Campbell]

Kenneth...
I wonder if this is a glitch that is peculiar to your machine, or many others? I usually run my Squaring, home and warmup routines prior to hitting the [Sent to ShopBot] button, so I have never seen this happen. Do you do similar? You then close SB3? Why?

Scott...
Since you seem knowledgable on this, is there a way to make this feature true "DTM" as Ted calls it? As far as I can see you must save the file and then select it to run. The only possible steps saved would be 1) closing Pwks/VCPro, 2) having to remember the file name as it appears to use the save location as the default "1st look" location.
Other than a mouse click on the [Load Part File] button, not really any more direct than any other post I have seen. My testing was done with SB3 and VCPro both running. So, add double click of SB3 icon to the saving click list. Please correct me where I am wrong.

[srwtlc]

Gary,

Yes, you can change its behavior by editing the ShopBot_run.ini file. There's a .txt file in C:\Program Files\ShopBot\Developer Tools\Docs named SbW_CommandLine_Format.txt that has the parameters used to pass to the command line for various options such as how SB3 is opened, closed, displayed, and offset.


For example, if you wanted to have SB3 open and run the file with no further input, you would change the .ini file to read...

sb3.exe
%s,,4,,0,0,0

The default is for SB3 to open in move/cut mode with the file selected and the fill-in sheet open.

[Gary Campbell]

Scott...
Thanks so much, and since I am over my pay grade here, just to be sure. (for me)

I would like to test as follows:
SB3>move cut
NO save
No select
no input sheet.
Will your provided line above fit those parameters?

Thanks in advance

[ted]

Wow, everyone sure is busy on a holiday!

Jack ... yes, I did take the old beta down for a little while today as I was putting a new one up. You should be able to download 3.7.1beta12 now ... sorry.

Now, onto the DTM ... this is not a real big deal. Way back in the PartWizard days, you could send your file to ShopBot without having to open and load it into ShopBot. The DTM in PartWorks basically just re-implements the system for PartWorks. As several have noted, the DTM uses the same file passing functionality that has been available when running ShopBot from a command line for many years. And, it is used by programs such as eCabinets to pass a file to ShopBot. [Yes, Ken ... it should start ShopBot if it is not running and has always done it on our computers. We should figure out why it does not work on yours ... it might be informative.]

In terms of the current beta, the two TC posts (pp's with TC and MM and INCHES in the name) have been modified to be fully functional for DTM. They, along with the ShopBot_run.ini file need to be copied from C:\Sbparts\PartWorksPosts to the post folder of whichever version of the software you are using. This will work with PartWorks 2.5 and 3.0 as well as V-CarvePro and Aspire (and back one version in each).

Just to confuse you, the installer for PartWorks3.0 installs the new posts, but with "(DIRECT)" in the name -- our thought being to make this optional at the moment, before making it permanent with the next version of the software. But I can see this is just creating more confusion than it is worth. If you use these with 3.6.30, or 3.6.32 (now up) remember to pick the post with DIRECT in the name.

Since I have your attention, there is one more subtle thing. As Scott mentioned above, the function which passes the file to ShopBot has a number of options for how it is run. In the recent PW3 install, for the ShopBot_run.ini file which defines the passing options in the post we used:

sb3.exe
%s,,1,,0,0,0

This setup forces a start of ShopBot in Move/Cut Mode if the tool is connected. Though it allows you to confirm running the file at several points. If you are in Preview when the pass is made, the tool will switch to Cutting if connected. I believe that the better option which we will use in the future (and do the beta) is:

sb3.exe
%s,,0,,0,0,0

which causes the file to run in Preview if the software is in Preview or was last closed in Preview, and Move if in Move. This way, if you just want to Preview files rather than run them, you can set the software to Preview. There are several other option for running files using this system and the various Command line parameters are described in Programming Handbook which you can find under Help. You can change the file and thus putter with the "meaning" of DTM if you would like.

We were hoping that this system might simplify things, but at the moment fear that we may have just created confusion. Keep in mind that the bottom line is that an SBP Part File is always created in the process. You can always run it in the normal way. This is just a little shortcut for the cases where everything is set up and ready to run -- then it's just toolpath ... and click to print.

Ted Hall, ShopBot Tools

[srwtlc]

Gary,

Not being at the machine, I can only say that it should work that way if you use "4" in the .ini file

sb3.exe
%s,,4,,0,0,0

4 = MOVE/CUT; no stop for Fill-In

If I use "5" at my desktop, SB3 opens in preview and runs the file with no further action required.

Not sure what you mean by "No save", but you do need to save the toolpath in VCP/Aspire/PartWorks. Once it is saved, the .ini file is executed and SB3 does it's thing.

If desired, a person could make a PostP for each senario using a different .ini file. Open in preview or cut, fill-in, no fill-in, offset, close when finished, etc.

Scott

Edited: Ted got in while I was checkin' things out. ;-) Thanks for the further explanation Ted.

[ken_rychlik]

Gary,

The boxes of sb3 and the link would overlap on my pc, so I couldn't see all of my link page while the sb3 is active. That had me closing the sb3 after getting it ready with the c3, warm up, ect...

When I first used it, I thought it was a glitch in my pc or something, but the more I used it, I figured it out.

I drug the boxes around to allow both programs to be up at the same time and it doesn't lock up anymore. I kind of figured it out by accident.

When I got to thinking about the direct to machine link, it made me wonder if the same issue would come up.

On the link, it would open the sb3, but when loading the files, it would lock up before starting the file.

I think the sb3 wasn't fully open before instructions on where to go were being sent, thus causing the issue. If a delay would be there to allow the sb3 to stabilize a little before thowing instructions at it, maybe that would help. I just learned what not to do on mine and went forward.

That was also with 3.6.20 and I have gone to 3.6.28 since then. I got used to running it "my way" so I have not tried to have the link open sb3 since I changed sb3 versions.

Ted,

My machine is running custom tool change files, and I don't know if that has anything to do with it. I am always told to get rid of my files and load a fresh copy of oem files whenever I call for support. Even though I am very happy with the support offered and the help I have gotten along the way, I don't want to take off everything and start over when an issue comes up. If you really want to have some fun, do a pause/resume while the link is running on one of your machines and see what happens. lol

[Gary Campbell]

Ted and Scott...
Thank you both for the explanation. At least from my point there is no confusion. I appreciate the ability for a few tweaks. As usual, I am looking for one more "little one"

As I am used to working with the "pass thru" capabilities when using the SB Link I believe the following happens:
When Send to ShopBot button is pressed, a file is created
That file, without any user input, is run.
That file, albeit hidden, can be run again (if found)
That file will be overwritten when process is repeated.

I would like to replicate that process. To me it is especially valuable when testing and/or prototyping as I can "send a single toolpath to machine" to test cutting speeds or movement action. It would save a large number of run a partial file and pause. That method has not always worked out well for me.

If this can be done, I am sure I wont be the only user thatwould want to use this feature. I think in the past most users would have voted against it, however, after with time using the ShopBot Link myself and a good number of others realize this is a very useful feature.

Sorry about gas on the fire. :D My Mom will tell you I ALWAYS poked the hornets nest with a stick.

[srwtlc]

As I am used to working with the "pass thru" capabilities when using the SB Link I believe the following happens:
When Send to ShopBot button is pressed, a file is created
That file, without any user input, is run.
That file, albeit hidden, can be run again (if found)
That file will be overwritten when process is repeated.

Saving the toolpath with DTM checked would basically be the same as "Send to ShopBot" and the only user input would be to give the file a name and location (I'm assuming that this is done automatically by eCabs with the job name or something) which makes it easier for the user to find it again if needed and if changes need to be made (feeds, speeds, shape, etc.) the toolpath is recalculated and saved again (overwritten). Wash and repeat. ;)

Because I use a screen/desktop switcher, I don't know how well all this would work for me. I've gotten to be pretty quick with saving a toolpath or paths, switching to the SB desktop and running/testing a file, and if need be switch back to the other desktop that has Aspire open, make some changes and switch back to SB3 to run it again. Sounds like a lot, but all I need to do is hit ctrl-1 or ctrl-2 on the numeric keypad to swap desktops back and forth. Might have to play with it to see how it behaves.

[Gary Campbell]

Scott...
the Link does save a file that is located somewhere in the hidden data path. It can and has been found and recut, but there is no reason to do so as it is much easier to hit the "send to shopbot" button. This file is overwritten each time a job is sent to the machine. I was wishing for yet another parameter like "/current_DTM_file.sbp" to be added to the .ini so that my DTM file would have a name and location and be autosaved without user input to save/load.

I wish for a lot of things that dont come true. Thanks again

[Gary Campbell]

Scott....
Thanks for the parameter change. Tested this morning and it works well. Set SB3 to preview to allow access to VCPro toolpath options, and selected the "Direct to Machine" option. SB3 was switched to Move/Cut, I was prompted to name the file, and it ran.

Perfect! Thanks to all.

[ken_rychlik]

I am trying to get this option running and the

ShopBot_run.ini

file is causing V carve to not recognize the post.

Can someone tell me where in the post to input this line?

I put it just after the

DIRECT_OUTPUT = "DIRECT to ShopBot|ShopBot_run.ini"

line, which was put under the "inches" but this must be the wrong place for it.

Thanks

[srwtlc]

Kenneth, are you saying that you modified your post to look like this...

DIRECT_OUTPUT = "DIRECT to ShopBot|ShopBot_run.ini"

ShopBot_run.ini

If so, you shouldn't put that line there. All you need is the first line. You have to copy the actual "ShopBot_run.ini" file and paste it in your PostP folder.

Hope that gets you going.

Scott

[ken_rychlik]

That sounds like what I did wrong.

Now I have to try and find that file to copy and paste.

Would it go in the same area?

Thanks

[ken_rychlik]

Can someone tell me where the shopbot_run.ini file is located? I can't seem to find it.

Thanks

[Gary Campbell]

Here is one for you:

Change file ext to ".ini"

[ken_rychlik]

I'm having nuthin but bad luck. I went to unzip it and it told me the folder was empty.

Where did ya find it on your pc?

[Gary Campbell]

Kenneth...

Here is the contents of the file:

sb3.exe
%s,,4,,0,0,0

Look above and see which of the parameters you wish to use, possibly in place of the "4"

[ken_rychlik]

Thanks Gary, but I would still love to know where it's at... lol

V carve 6.0 gives me an error when I start it. It doesn't like the sb3.exe for some reason.

More info. It has something to do with where in the post p I place it. I moved it down to the begin header area and v carve took the post. When I tried to send a file to open the machine it still gave me an error message that it would not run the ini file.

Where does it go in the post p ?

[Gary Campbell]

Ken...
Try these:

Change file ext to .pp and .ini as needed

[ken_rychlik]

Where does this info go?

sb3.exe
%s,,4,,0,0,0

It is not in the post processor you put up.

When I put it in the post processor, I get error messages.

I guess it's still to hot in Texas , because I am still missing the boat.:confused:

[srwtlc]

Kenneth,

The original .ini file should be able to be found in C:\SbParts\PartWorksPosts if you didn't cut or delete it.

Remove the "sb3.exe %s,,4,,0,0,0" text from within your postp, like Gary's shows. If you put it in your postp, it will cause VCP to throw up an error.

Paste the .ini file into your postp folder along with the other postp's.

Your PostP folder (if cleared of unneeded postp's) should look like this (ignore my custom name)....

[ken_rychlik]

Thanks Scott, I'm getting closer.

That ini file was not in there. I added one, but it is still callling it a pp file. Will this fly, or do I need a different type of file format?

[ken_rychlik]

Still won't fly.

Can you copy and post the ini file for me? V carve still thinks it's a post processor.

The air must be really thick down here. lol

[ken_rychlik]

I managed to find a config settings type of folder elsewhere and coppied the info into it.

I still have these two error messages, even when using Gary's post.

Giving up for tonight.

[ken_rychlik]

Here is what my post processor file area looks like and the info in the ini file.

[srwtlc]

Kenneth,

I think I see something that may be the problem or a problem after fixing the first problem.

I looks like you may have the .ini file named with a double extension (.ini.ini).

If you go to your postp folder, you'll see (as in your attached image) that your postp's don't show a file type extension in there name, but it looks like the "ShopBot_run.ini" file does have one. If you go up to "Tools/Folder Options" and click on the "View" tab, look for "Hide extensions for known file types" and remove the check mark from it. Hit "Apply/OK" and you should see that your "ShopBot_run.ini" has an extra .ini. Rename that to have only one .ini and you should be good to go.

Scott

[ken_rychlik]

Thanks Scott.

That did it. I need to play with what numbers I have in there, but at least it's opening.

[srwtlc]

Great, goes to show ya that two ini's don't make an outi. :p