Anatomy of a Reception Desk

[bleeth]

In addition to basic cabinet parts we also use the bot regularly for Reception desks, Admin and Nurse desks, Bar walls, etc. I have attched a few shots of a current project in which we are building a fairly large (but not huge) Reception desk that will end up with Maple veneer and solid surface (Corian) work surfaces and transaction tops.
We cut all desk wall frames on the bot as they always have at least a toekick notch and penetration slots for electrical and data wiring and, of course, the bot is a lot more efficient at this then doing them by hand. On curved desks we also will cut the plates and countertops and sub-tops.
On a larger curved desk we will also to a floor template with all the principle construction lines for accurate layout and assembly so later parts, like the countertops, will fit with minimal adjustment.
In the attached shots you see the template laid out, a close up of some lines on it, frames being cut, and the frame assembly.
We start with a dwg of our shop drawing and bring the lines into Artcam where some things may be added and others deleted so we get all the info we need on the template for the builder to layout the entire project.
As we get further into the project I'll take some more pics. Basically, at this point, I spent about 4-6hours on the computer tweaking and generating cut files, a couple hours cutting, and one day getting this much assembly done. In the old days when I would do them by hand this would be close to a weeks work.

[kevin]

Thanks for the post
I don't do any comerical .But I like learning new tecniques .What scare me in comerical is collecting after

[chiloquinruss]

"after " - 50% down, balance COD. If it's a major, set milestones on the whole job upfront, both sign, and get PAID for each milestone reached, including FULL payment upon completion. No where on your business card does it say 'Bank of ShopBot'! :D Russ

[Brady Watson]

Nice Dave! Can't wait to see it all together.

Hey...wipe your greazy face juice off your phone's camera...:D:D:D

-B

[bleeth]

As far as payment goes, it could be worse. We could be operating a retail goods store or distributors warehouse and need to buy all the inventory, merchandise it, open the doors, and then have customers buying it a bit at a time. My terms actually vary depending on the type of client and job. For larger commercial jobs the terms are the same for all sub-contractors. If you don't like them, you don't bid the jobs to start with. Over the last year or so I've lowered the percentage of institutional jobs I do as they have been getting harder to get change orders approved and slower on payments. Most of my clients now issue payments within a few weeks of invoice and I bill deposits on contract. I also don't have to spend umpteen weeks with Mrs. Jones on her kitchen layout revised 6 times before I can actually give her a final price and then listen to how it's cheaper at Home Depot!!

[kevin]

There only 5 changes. The problem in my area with commercial work is where booming all these new construction companies are popping up all over the place they don’t have skilled superintends or general contractors .Where the last one in and we find all the problem and they are learning on the job at are expense. Plus I only have 2 employees we get spread pretty thin
What I like about private client is I design and decided all material .I’m general contractor the buck stops here .I love the freedom to try new thing
Their spending 14 billion about an hour away we fell the finical windfall housing is popping up everywhere .Newfoundland is turning in to the Costo of resources to the world .In Labdour there finishing up the biggest iron ore mine in the world .So the skilled labor hasn’t caught up with the work
http://news.exxonmobil.com/press-release/exxonmobil-announces-hebron-oil-project-proceed-canadas-east-coast (http://news.exxonmobil.com/press-release/exxonmobil-announces-hebron-oil-project-proceed-canadas-east-coast)
I know a lot of my friends on the mainland say how are you making it here? Most people don’t realize the boom here
When I living in Montreal commercial job where corrupt with kickbacks .It was scary I worked on a restaurant where they were changing equipment with cheaper equipment and keeping the money needless to say the cabinets didn’t fit .There quote was the people that financed this don’t care and this it’s your problem don’t settle things in court I’ll leave at that.
I have a canned letter for commercial work I send when they ask me to bid that’s how they do it here. I find there lazy and want you to do the drawing for free
TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN:
Thank you for your recent interest in our company. Our policy on commercial jobs is as following:
1. All clients asking us to bid on jobs will bring all drawings to the above address for our review; if drawings are not correct, and we have to do modifications, charges will be applied. First hour will be free and all subsequent hours will be billed at $67.00 an hour.
2. All jobs, if accepted, will have a strict payment policy. 40% will be paid upon acceptance of the contract; the next 40% will be paid upon review of cabinets by client, being ND Dobbin, in my shop. All cabinetry will not leave my shop until the remaining 20% is paid.
3. Installation will be a separate contract. And will be graded on experience of superintendent, general contractors, and the general organization of the project. All installation work is based on $69.00 an hour.

We are a high-end cabinet company. We are easily capable of doing commercial work. I have been a cabinetmaker for over 20 years. I suggest you visit the shop as opposed to sending out faxes. We do not finance projects. And we expect the general contractor and architect and/or owners to take responsibility for their projects in a professional manner.
Dave I don’t say no to commercial just careful

[bleeth]

Here the curved part of the desk is skinned in front and the rectangular end units are in place. The first shot is from the vantage point of behind the existing wall that the desk will go against. As of yesterday the inside was also skinned and access panels are laid out. It, of course, was disassembled for skinning and laid on the bench. When complete it will actually be shipped in two parts (Field join where the double studs are in the second shot) plus the back end wall.

I totally understand the plusses and minuses of commercial vs residential. Although not our mainstay I still do some residential for special clients but believe me, some of our commercial projects are quite high end also. We recently finished a restaurant job that used an unbelievable amount of wenge and lacquered panels. We also did all the booths and some of the fabric was over $150/yd. My final photo shoot of the place is coming soon and the bot did plenty there as well.

I won't deal with anyone who suggests a kickback. One of the reasons I got out of residential in this area is the inherent dishonesty of so many of the Interior Designers that were our clients. Years ago I lived across Florida in Sarasota and working for Designers there was a joy.

I don't mind a sup't or GC project manager who doesn't understand our trade too well as long as they are not so ego driven as to be unable to be honest about it. I've made many of them our friends by patiently explaining what we have to do to make their project come out right and the money it will cost them if walls are out by too much, etc. The real fun ones are the ones who did a couple home carpentry projects and think they are experts. "After all, it's just boxes, right?" That will really make me :mad:. For those who haven't done serious commercial work, even the cabinets need to be technically perfect since we have many elevations that are 20-30 feet long and if you have that kind of wall and all the doors are just plain laminate slabs you better have everything milled and installed just right or it looks like total ****. It's the same thing when you have 50-100 feet of flat veneer panels on a wall and particularly interesting when the walls are curved. One edge of one panel out of place and the whole affect is shot.

Having spent my working life (and if you don't know, I am well over 60 now) building everything from race boats, yachts, ships (Yes-I was a union shipwright), houses, condos, residential furniture and cabinets, and all the commercial "land-based" projects we specialize in now, I respect anyone who becomes a well skilled carpenter in any aspect of it.

For the hell of it I have also attached a picture of one of the first projects I did with my bot shortly after I bought it. All the bending forms for the doors as well as the curved parts were bot generated and, naturally, I did the veneer work, not with sheets, but hand trimmed and vacuum bagged to the carcass. This one was my design and houses the home's music system.

[steve fedor]

Ni$e work. I have a few ?'s. How are you attaching the curved panels to the frame work. Are the panels bendie ply veneered by you. Do you do your own finishing or do you outsource. You are fortunate to be able to build it in 2 sections. Our last project the freight elevator went to the 4th floor and we had to run the mi raid of individual parts and panels to the 6'x6'x8'6" pedestrian elevator to the 12th floor. Needless to say we spent a-lot of time mapping out part assembly and field joints for final assembly on site. Your work speaks for itself.

[myxpykalix]

I'm just jealous of all the space he has..:eek:

[beacon14]

Thanks for posting pics and details. I'm looking forward to seeing the project progress to completion.

That curved wall cabinet is the bomb. The glass shop must have loved you for those pointy ends.

[chiloquinruss]

"I'm just jealous of all the space he has" Jack I'll make ya' a deal, I'll trade ya' some space if ya' trade me some of your skills! :) Russ

[myxpykalix]

Ok Russ that's a deal. The problem is, my skill, much like my good looks...I was born with:rolleyes: so that's hard to pass on....

You on the other hand will need to package up that space in an awful big box for shipping:D

[bleeth]

Glue and staples. The bending ply comes straight from our distributor. In this case he had to have it brought in as this is a "green" job so everything is FSC/NAUF and although they stock certain products that way, not everything we need for this project. The veneer on this one will be wood on wood sheets and we use a Wilsonart veneer adhesive for that which is both low emitting and won't "bubble" from the finish outgassing.
We do our own finishing at this time. I've handled it both ways and they both have their plusses and minuses.
This jobsite has a huge freight elevator. Several years back we did a restaurant on top of a 55 story building and had to transfer elevators twice to get up there. The main bar had to be built in 6' sections.

Dave: Thanks; The veneer is called Mozambique and/or Daniella. I chose it both for it's looks and I have a niece who's name is......., yep. For you guys who don't know it already Herzog Veneer in North Carolina has some great custom grade stuff they will sell in smaller flitch quantity and you see it on line as well. The shop that did that glass had a laser cutter. I say "had" as they since have gone under and the folks that run the plant now only will do shower door type stuff and won't deal in custom at all. We do still have several large glass plants in the area though so just about anything can be had. Biggest issue I have is properly done bent glass. Don't need it very often but when we do getting it done to spec is a royal pain.

Just remember Jack: Big space equals big bills! On the other hand at my quickly advancing age if you would like mine, just make me an offer. I'll throw in the equipment, clients, employees, and for a bonus you can have the headaches and sleepless nights. My wife and I are aching to get back to Russ's neck of the woods.

[myxpykalix]

Your offer sounds appealing however, unless you are capable of performing the "Vulcan Mind Meld" so you can also convey your wisdom, expertise and experience then all I would be getting is a bunch of tools and bills:eek:

[bleeth]

No mind meld-One could however pay me to stick around a few months to teach how to screw up all the stuff the same way I do.

[myxpykalix]

I think i could figure that part out all on my own!:eek:

[bleeth]

Well, enough digression: Back to the thread topic.
Here is all the base components set up. We'll be cutting full size mock-ups of the counters next (As soon as the glue dries on the latest spoil-board replacement) to verify fit before disassembly, veneering, finishing, and cutting the actual countertops. Once it's taken apart we start on the next one which is less involved. In the interim all the exterior veneer is laid up 8 X 4 and sequence matched. Inside under the counter matching is much less critical unless you're a mouse! The doors and drawer faces are also balanced and since this is a AWI premium project all grain will run vertical. I've also included a screen shot of the vectors used to create the various cutting files of the template, desk plates, counters, etc.

[johnh]

Dave, thats awesome.

[bleeth]

I just noticed I forgot to upload the shots with the countertop. Cutting time for all sheets was about 30 minutes and maybe 15 minutes to lift those lines from my artwork and toolpath them.
We then got held up due to supplier sending wrong veneer. New shipment on the way.

[scottp55]

Dave, Beautiful job, but a question: On that curved cantilevered countertop section, I see what looks to be temp supports. Is there an additional support/plywood layer/ or edge detail to firm it up? Always looking for workspace in the house and shop like that for the wheelchair. Fastened to cantilever how? Thanks.

[bleeth]

Permanent support may vary by particular job and specs. For this one there were some A&M Steel brackets added.
http://www.aandmhardware.com/regular-brackets.php.

The top you see is the sub-top. Final surface was Corian.

The desk was covered in cardboard right after my men installed it and by the time the cardboard was removed we were long gone from the site, which is way down in South Miami about 1 1/2 hours from my shop, so I haven't gotten "finale" shots yet.

[kevin]

Dave looks good I'm interested in this type of work

I liked seeing the process .For the finishing how awkward was it

[scottp55]

Thanks Dave, They have some concealed brackets too that look like they might help my kneecaps survive. Probably go 2layers 3/4 ply screwed and glued. Were they sturdy enough to sit on? What was free hanging depth of counter? Thanks again. Love your audio cabinet but think my Adcom's would melt my other components:)

[bleeth]

Finishing was pretty straight forward. It was maple with a very light tone. For the outside I got 8 x 4 sequenced sheets so the grain balanced.

The brackets are rated at like 1500 lbs load each. What counts is having proper blocking in the chase wall. With a standard 25" deep counter you'd have to have really long legs to hit them. I usually use the 18 x 18's for 25" deep counters so there is no ADA issue either.

[scottp55]

Thanks Dave, Looking to make a big corner in the shop more usable.

[johnh]

Dave do you have a final installed pic? The shop pics were great. Excellent work.

How do you approach design on something like this? Counter height, counter depth, leg clearance, toe space, ledge height, etc. Was this job designed by an architect? Even if it was I am sure you are capable... what resource would be good to make sure you don't design yourself into an unusable piece of firewood?