Trying to decide between CNC routers

[myxpykalix]

Doug,
I can't give you mechanical comparisions but I would check the forums for the other machines (if they exist) and ask their experiences with tech support, cost of repairs, any cost for talking to tech support (some places do charge) and how much is their forums used?

In the span of 10 hours you've gotten 15 responses, all positive, ranging from small machines to large machines.

I've had a 5x10 table with an indexer since 2006 and although i don't run it everyday I don't think i have called tech support more then twice since i've owned mine.

When i have called you get people who really act like they want to help you rather then making you feel like you are imposing on them. They initially sent me a wrong gantry, when i called I had another one the next day. Customer service is a top priority.

This philosophy must come from the head guy Ted Hall who most of us probably all know and have talked to at one of the Camp Shopbots. I have made request for software revisions which have been implemented in the past (still waiting on one tho...) and so they show a responsiveness to their customers.

Most importantly though is the quality of the machine itself. If it was a piece of **** with problems plenty of us would be griping and you really don't see that here. They don't censor us (unless we start acting like children).

However as stated the biggest asset you have owning a shopbot is access to the wealth of experience and knowledge that resides on this forum. Whenever i need advice or help 24 hours a day I can usually post a question and have an answer in minutes.
So from this perspective I recommend a shopbot, get the biggest one you can affored. Even a used larger one then a smaller new one is a good deal. You will find you will be asked to make things you never thought of before and you don't want to limit your options.
I have a 5x10 table but honestly 75% of all my cutting can be done on a 4x4 table.
So buy a shopbot because then you get to hang out with us!

[cabnet636]

I have indeed seen the Stingers, look like fine units ,,, But I put them out of contention for no other reason than not to further complicate the decision making process.
Also, don't really want to have to set up a dedicated computer for control, which would, obviously, further add to the cost.

I guess I should still consider the Buddy, I do have the funds for it.
Shipping cost doesn't appear on the site, I'm almost afraid to ask what that would be for a 600 lb unit.

i am a bit courious, how do you plan to operate any of these cnc machines without a controller computer?

hey gene we are on in columbia march 25/26 sat all aspire!!

eagle globe and anchor are now installed

[Xray]

i am a bit courious, how do you plan to operate any of these cnc machines without a controller computer?

I believe "dedicated" is the operative word.
As I understand it, the Stinger requires a computer with a special controller card installed ?
And I read the recommendations, basically to run or load nothing else on the OS besides the controlling software.

[michael_schwartz]

I believe "dedicated" is the operative word.
As I understand it, the Stinger requires a computer with a special controller card installed ?
And I read the recommendations, basically to run or load nothing else on the OS besides the controlling software.

Almost all CNC equipment will require a PC to run the software that controls the machine. The ShopBot control software is available for download free of charge, and can be run in preview mode without a machine if you want to get an idea of what it does.

http://shopbottools.com/mSupport/controlsoftware.htm

A bare bones installation of windows on a dedicated PC is recommended due to the fact that non essential software or hardware can and likely will cause issues. Communication between the software, and machine is critical, and you don't want to introduce anything that isn't necessary into the picture.

I can't comment on what interface the stinger uses, but with the ShopBot, your going to want a dedicated USB 2.0 card for the machine.

You really only need a PC that is somewhat recent. There are allot of refurbished off lease pc's that come with XP Pro. Just make sure to throw away the no name keyboard and mouse that may come as a part of a bundle and replace them with name brand counterparts. I had some USB problems which I traced to such accessories.

[Xray]

I see your pont Mike, no doubt valid ,, And I'm aware that CNC equipment requires a PC.
I have went from $5,000+ to $8,000+, want to avoid adding another $500 for a computer, when I have 3 sitting here already.
I sure won't be watching any videos or playing Starcraft 2 on the computer while running code !
But if I have to get another computer, it is what it is.

I just might recoil when I find out the shipping charge on the Buddy, think I'll call later this afternoon and find out.

[ken_rychlik]

The pc to run the bot needs to be stripped of auto updates, anti virus, screen savers, power savers, and anything running in the background that could interfere with operation of the machine. You basically wil want a bare bones operating system. Most older pcs you may have in a closet somewhere would do. Add some ram and a dedicated usb card though.

Don't forget to check craigslist.org in your area for used ones.

In fact if you post your area, you can probably find someone willing to show you theirs in operation also.

[dana_swift]

Doug.

Like yourself, I once studied everything I could read on the web. There were big expensive machines. And little cheap ones.

Money was an issue (it always is) so I needed to keep costs down.

I too was looking for the bottom end "entry level" machine. At the time all Shopbot offered was the "not-yet-shipping" BT-32.

It seemed to me I was placing a bet, and the only thing I could be sure of is reputation. SB clearly had the edge. Their website made the difference. It explained so much. I could read the manuals, I could study. They were very open.

So.. I called and a HUMAN answered the phone. I didn't have to push something before I could make a language choice. That support is still there.

Speaking of humans, when you call tech support, these guys USE shopbots and KNOW what you are talking about when you are having a problem. They are not reading from a script in some off-shore country.

I have one of the very early BT-32's. I have owned it for roughly four years now. SB then came out with the powersticks, and I felt like I not only had made the right choice, I was dealing with a company that was interested in improving their products.

My BT-32 is significantly different than the modern BT's. I like them both. I have access to a modern BT-48 (with powersticks also) it is a great machine period.

The BT's are built from the same parts as the gantry routers, so they are incredibly tough.

When I ordered my BT I was told that it would not work with an indexer. They did not want to get my expectations up. Guess what? SB supports their machine even if you modify it! I did, and now I have an indexer on it. (Love that too!). I am currently working on a 5th axis for my humble BT-32.

A shark is probably a nice machine with a lot of great owners also. But can it expand to 5 axes? Or four for that matter? What happens to the warranty when you take it apart and re-assemble it "your way"?

Shopbot expects you to change your machine to meet your needs. The warranty still applies. The support is still there.

With a BT machine you can have the upgrade option of an 8' powerstick and hog out a full sheet of plywood. Try that on a shark.

With that all said, most of my projects still fit nicely on my original 24x34 cutting area. When they dont, I did buy the powersticks.

And another option to mention. Vacuum hold-down. Mechanical hold down is simpler, cheaper, and more reliable. So why vacuum? Fast and "pretty good". I created a vacuum table for my BT-32 (pictures posted here on the forum). I still use it, and the mechanical table also. I use whatever the project needs. Its quick to change from one to the other. (Heavy I admit.)

I don't think the SB desktop has an indexer or vacuum either. But I would be surprised if somebody on here doesn't figure it out and post "how to". When they do, SB will still support it.

Whatever decision you make, buy something. My only regret is not getting started sooner. I spent over a YEAR getting paralysis through analysis.

Get started. Welcome to the world of CNC. It hope it changes your life as positively as it did mine.

And a final comment. What is the name of the person behind the shark? With Shopbot its Ted Hall. If you ever meet him, he is very personable enjoys talking to his customers, and really KNOWS shopbots. All about shopbots. Is the person behind the shark an enthusiast or an investment banker?

Just curious..

Dana

[gc3]

I believe "dedicated" is the operative word.
As I understand it, the Stinger requires a computer with a special controller card installed ?
And I read the recommendations, basically to run or load nothing else on the OS besides the controlling software.

http://www.wincnc.net/mapp_router.php

http://www.machsupport.com/

I believe these are the 2 types of control software for the stinger.

[Xray]

Well, the Buddy is out of contention.
I am not paying $1,000 for shipping - Now I can see why the shipping price is not on the web page, most folks would click right away after seeing that.
Also notice they want a cool $900 for the "ready to roll upgrade package", which consists of a router, 8 bits and a set of wheels.
Who in their right mind would pay that much for so little ?

Thanks for the advice everyone, read it all with interest.
Not sure what I'm going to do now, I've talked myself out of a small desktop, and also don't care to get raped on shipping.
I understand, heavy items cost $$ to ship ,, But $1,000 ?? Surely, that cannot be actual.
Raking on shipping is really something that gets my goat, I'd prefer they work their padding into the item itself rather than shipping.
I guess I'm either going to look into acquiring one locally, reconsider once again if a desktop will meet my needs, or put my CNC goals on the back burner for now.

[ken_rychlik]

That does seem expensive for shipping. Where are you located?