How many dummies does it take to start a spindle?

[johnm]

Folks -

Got the 'bot together, ready to go, double checked EVERYTHING. XYZ moves okay, no cable binds, all looks good... 'ceptin'.....

How the heck to I start the spindle? I can start it up in the keypad, but in the table surfacing instructions it just says "start your router"... would that I could! I feel like a real dummy! I've run all the programmng changes on the VFD so that it is supposed to be under shopbot control, but NOW what?

I'd sure appreciate some help. The wife AND the dog are snickering at me from a safe distance.

John Moorhead

PS: Pls forgive - I've also posted this in TS and I would REALLY like to suface the table tonight...

[richards]

A contactor (relay) in the control box turns the spindle on/off; however, to ensure safety, turning the spindle on is a multi-step operation.

Click on the keyboard icon and then turn on the number 1 output by clicking the number 1 button. As soon as you press the START button on the control box, the spindle should start. (That's the method I use to warm up the spindle everyday for ten minutes prior to cutting.)

You can also insert commands in your sbp files to turn the spindle on/off. Sample:

START:
GOSUB INIT
FP, file_name.sbp,,,,,2
GOTO FINI

INIT:
SA
JZ, 1.0
J2, 0,0
SO, 1, 1
RETURN

FINI:
JZ, 1.0
SO, 1, 0
J2, 0, 0
END
' End of file

The SO, 1, x command turns the spindle on/off. However, to actually start the spindle, a pop-up prompt will appear on the screen to tell you to push the START button.

[johnm]

Mike -

Thanks for your comments, but I am not getting any on screen pop up prompt at all. Manually through the Keypad it'll start, but only at presumably low speed.

Any ideas??

John

[richards]

John,

The speed of the spindle is totally controlled by the VFD (at least on my unit). I warm the spindle up at about 9,000 RPM and then cut at 13,000 - 15,000, depending on other factors.

There are some parameters that need to be setup in the VFD. My unit came with a sheet giving the default settings, but I think that the VFD was already correctly setup from PDS Colombo. (I'm not at the shop right now, so I can't check my notes.) In any case, my unit has four modes which are:

1. Show actual speed of the spindle
2. Show amps being drawn by the spindle
3. Show frequency being used by the VFD
4. Modify spindle speed. (Using the arrow key, you select which number you want to change in the spindle speed setting.)

If you've manually turned on the number 1 output button in keypad mode and then exit keypad mode, the pop-up screen should appear as soon as you use the FP command. (Again, I'm working from memory, since I always click off the number 1 button before leaving the manual keypad mode.)

One other possibility is that the command is SO,1,1 with the O being the letter O in SO and not the number zero. The command stands for SET OUTPUT, output number, on/off where 1=ON and (zero) 0=OFF.

(I typed in S0(zero), 1,1 yesterday and scraped a brand new $60 compression cutter 1/2 inch across a piece of melamine coated particle board before I could hit the emergency stop button.)

It seems to me if the manual keypad mode is working, then everything must be wired properly. However, there is a jumper (possibly two jumpers) on the controller board where you select SPINDLE or ROUTER. I wish I were at the shop so that I could tell you exactly how many jumpers and exactly where they are. If I remember correctly, the jumper(s) are near the middle of the board in the vertical direction and about 1/3 of the way away from the LEFT side of the controller board. The words SPINDLE and ROUTER are silk-screened onto the controller board.

[johnm]

All -

Got it goin'! Rose found another post in the forum and we got the spindle running! We've surfaced the table and have a couple of low and high spots that will need more attention.

What a relief!

John Moorhead

[johnm]

Mike -

Thanks for your detailed remarks - how do you check the current that the spindle is drawing, and the true speed? - that would be really handy.

I am impressed with how quiet the spindle is - a nice change from the router.

We have been going through warm up and cool down and having the infra thermometer is very helpful.

Overall, the table was 1/8" out along X and 1/32 on Y.... We will run another routine tomorrow, but I think I need to square up my Z a bit - I had some ridges...

Thanks again for your help.

John

[gerald_d]

John, which was the enlightening post that Rose found? This must be a candidate for a FAQ list.

[richards]

John,

My VFD is the Delta VFD-B model. When you cycle through the screen with the MODE key, you'll be able to see the various settings. There are three LED type characters that light up as you cycle through the modes - F, H, and U.

When the 'F' is lit up, the display is showing the frequency being used by the VFD to generate the desired speed.

When the 'H' is lit up, the VFD is showing the speed of the spindle - at least the speed at which the spindle is being commanded to spin. At rest, you'll see 0.0 and as the spindle starts up, you'll see the speed ramping until it reaches your preset speed.

When the 'U' is lit up, you can change the spindle speed as described by Morris Dovey in another post.

When neither the 'F', 'H' nor 'U' are lit, but when there is the character 'A' in the left-most position, the VFD is displaying AMPS. My unit usually runs at 4-5 amps for almost everything that I cut. Occasionally, it jumps to 6-7 amps.

One other MODE position on my unit shows the word 'FWD' to indicate the direction of rotation.

It looks like you're almost ready to run. There have been several posts on squaring up the Z-axis. I like to chuck a jig with a horizontal rod into the spindle. At the end of the horizontal rod, I attach a dial indicator. With the dial indicator mounted, I can get to 0.002 - 0.003 within a few minutes.

If your machine is like mine, you'll probably need to square up the y-axis every morning as you turn on the machine. As the last move of the day, I do a J2,-18,5 (I have the 120-60, but only use 97 inches for cutting). With the machine at a known location, I use a preset combination square to check both sides of the y-axis before powering up. Typically, I need to bump the left side about 1/16 inch. As soon as power is applied, the steppers keep everything aligned. (When I first got the Alpha, I spent about 15 minutes each morning loosening and tightening the y-axis bolts to align the machine. Finally, I realized that a rubber mallet or a gentle push to align everything worked.) By the way, others use stop blocks and other methods to square up the y-axis. After the machine is squared up, I run the C2 (z-zero) command and then the C3 command to set the 0,0 point. The whole process takes about two minutes.

[georgew]

Mike

I just purchased a 5hp Colombo and the Delta VFD-B to replace the old PC. This spindle is completely new to me and I could sure use a little help on set-up and operating procedures.

I plan on locating the VFD right next to the shopbot computer/controler and run cable from there to the spindle. That way I should have easy access to the VFD keypad. Do you think this will work OK?

The book that came with the VFD says nothing about how it works with the Colombo spindle. Could you please give me the "step by step" on how to turn on, warm up, set rpm and shut down?

Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
George

[richards]

George,

You didn't say whether you're using an Alpha or the PRT. If you're using an Alpha, the first step is to download the installation instructions from Shopbot from their www.shopbottools.com/manuals.htm site. The manual that you'll need is: "PRTalpha Spindle Wiring". Those instructions will show you how to connect the VFD to the control box.

I've mounted my VFD at eye level on the wall for easy access and to have physical separation from the Shopbot Controller. Others have mounted the VFD directly onto the controller box with excellent results.

My post above lists the various VFD modes. To set the speed, select the 'u' mode by pressing the MODE key until the 'u' LED is lit. One of the digits will be flashing. Press the LEFT arrow key until the digit that you want to change is flashing. Press the UP or DOWN arrow key until you've entered the proper number. (I normally warm the spindle up at 10,000 RPM and then run at 13,000 to 15,000 depending on the material and the cutter being used. I NEVER RUN IT FASTER THAN 18,000 RPM.)

To actually turn on the spindle for warm-up, start the SB3 program, click on the Keypad ICON to go into manual control mode, click the OUTPUT 1 switch to turn it on, and then press the START button on the Shopbot control box (large green push button on my unit). At this point, the spindle should start. After the ten-minute warm-up period has expired, click the OUTPUT 1 switch to turn the spindle off.

After the spindle is at proper temperature, I go to the VFD and change the RPM to the speed that I'll use when cutting.

I use program control instructions to turn the spindle on and off when cutting. To turn on the spindle in a cut file, after positioning the cutter at a safe height, I insert the instruction SO,1,1 into the cut file. (Be sure you type the letter O and not the number zero.) The program will prompt you to press the START key and to then press the ENTER key.

I insert the command SO,!,0 (the 1,0 are numbers - not letters) to stop the spindle.

Here are a few instructions to show the sequence:

SA
JZ, 1.0
J2, 0.0, 0.0
SO, 1, 1

<cut instructions go here>

JZ, 1.0
SO, 1, 0
J2, 0, 0
END

After you've finished your work, the PDS Colombo people recommend that you run the spindle in a cool-down cycle. You use the same steps to cool-down as you did to warm-up.

These steps/instructions work for my Alpha/Spindle combination. If you're not running an Alpha, someone with a PRT will have to post the steps/instructions that pertain to the PRT.