The Craft

[joe]

The Craft

This is a most honorable way to spend one’s life. For the dedicated there’s no end to growth. When we made our first signs there were lots of questions about layout and design. As time goes along, the beginner gets comfortable with their basics skills and starts to experiment. It’s an intrigue that never comes to an end.

For centuries artist have been working with the same laws and rules, known as the principals of layout and design. Those are the same we are using today. What’s so beautiful about our craft is we get to see out work out on the street knowing we are following the same paths. As I’m moving around my community I get to see my work. That’s one of the reasons it’s a unique business.

We need more dedication and less hobby tinkering.

Joe Crumley
www.normansignco.com

[maxheadroom]

'We need more dedication and less hobby tinkering.' Joe Crumley

No Comments? Excellent words Joe. I'd love to see just how many actually make a living, just by their own design and construction of original work.

'What kind of wood is this?' Anyone ever taken a class in wood species, or in today's vernacular, how about a web search? A recent post believes pine, is actually mahogany, and that the wood is 'solid'. Guess it depends on one's definition of 'solid'. After all the first picture - the edge detail - clearly displays 3 layers of 3/4" material - 3x 3/4 =2.25" - .125 through the planer x 2 = 2". Hobby material or material for a 'customers' job?

And are there any buried screws? How many of those $ 2.95 - 5 buck ebay bits will be broken when it hits a screw?

Is false economy still considered, or is that 'old fashioned thinking'?

How about a poll: Who is making a living right now, supporting a family, and paying the bills from the work they do, vs hobbyists? Me: sole support for decades.

'We need more dedication (through education and ones own research..rather than a quick fix on a forum) and less hobby tinkering.'

Times have changed. Some for the good, some not. More and more one hears 'I've got the job, I don't know what bits to use, don't know feed rate/rpm, don't know what materials to use, never done work like this before, need to gold leaf, what glue to use - (it's size), don't confuse me with the facts, just tell me how to do it'. Those will never be a threat to shops that have invested time learning, applying their craft, and learning first hand through trial and error.

Well said Joe.

[steve_g]

Walter...

Very few of us can be a arrogant as Joe... Don't get me wrong, I consider Joe a friend! (Hi Joe!) But he has the arrogance of someone who can afford to tell a customer or anyone else to take a flying leap if you don't want to do it "my way". I'm actually jealous... I want that attitude! I worked by "the sweat of my brow" and my hands for nearly 50 years... That entire time my customer base was built on friends and relatives of previous customers. An arrogant attitude could and did have a ripple effect... That kept me in line.

Officially... I'm retired and back in the hobbyist ranks, but truth be known, once you have been self-employed the fever never quits. Right now I'm working with two start-ups and would drop the "retired" status in a heart beat... If I can just keep the thing "beating"!

Something like 90% of new business is started in someone's garage, by hobbyists who have an idea and are just tinkering around. Based on this... It's my opinion that America needs more hobbyists working in garages and creating American Jobs!

SG

[kevin]

Joe

I know what your trying to say you really have to raise your game get out of your comfort zone.

My plan was simply do high end work push my self and hopefully don't go bankrupt trying.

Joe thanks for your time in posting I get a lot out of it

The outside crest I have to paint on the weekend the outside should I stay white or do something different .Yes its my house

One of goal are to do pubs inside and outside this is a warm-up

[Brian Harnett]

'We need more dedication and less hobby tinkering.' Joe Crumley

No Comments? Excellent words Joe. I'd love to see just how many actually make a living, just by their own design and construction of original work.

'What kind of wood is this?' Anyone ever taken a class in wood species, or in today's vernacular, how about a web search? A recent post believes pine, is actually mahogany, and that the wood is 'solid'. Guess it depends on one's definition of 'solid'. After all the first picture - the edge detail - clearly displays 3 layers of 3/4" material - 3x 3/4 =2.25" - .125 through the planer x 2 = 2". Hobby material or material for a 'customers' job?

And are there any buried screws? How many of those $ 2.95 - 5 buck ebay bits will be broken when it hits a screw?

Is false economy still considered, or is that 'old fashioned thinking'?

How about a poll: Who is making a living right now, supporting a family, and paying the bills from the work they do, vs hobbyists? Me: sole support for decades.

'We need more dedication (through education and ones own research..rather than a quick fix on a forum) and less hobby tinkering.'

Times have changed. Some for the good, some not. More and more one hears 'I've got the job, I don't know what bits to use, don't know feed rate/rpm, don't know what materials to use, never done work like this before, need to gold leaf, what glue to use - (it's size), don't confuse me with the facts, just tell me how to do it'. Those will never be a threat to shops that have invested time learning, applying their craft, and learning first hand through trial and error.

Well said Joe.

Walter, you have been a member of this forum for 3 years yet this is the first post I have seen of yours, have you not gained some information from the posts? I agree a lot are the same I don't know what I am doing stuff but some on this forum take the time to help not critique. Maybe you can contribute more often with your wisdom.

I been making a living for a while on my own some of my living started from hobbies, chainsaw carving is one of them I now make a good income of that "hobby".

Isn't it great there are people willing to go buy a bot that do not have experience, sometimes a fresh set of eyes sees things and improvements that experienced operators don't.

The dumbest question is the one not asked.

[Ajcoholic]

All I'm going to say is this... NO one starts at the "top". No one.

And you can quote me on that!

Many people are out there working there @$$'s off making a living. Most you will never hear from on the Internet. I know several who just can't be bothered to. But they are turning out great work. Every day. And doing just fine financially as well.

Sometimes I read things online that makes me proud and very glad I had a father who was both a master carpenter & woodworker but never once in his life told anyone how good he was, and told me always to let your work speak for itself, period. If you do good work, you don't have to tell anyone. The people who see what you do will.

[danhamm]

The "craft" the bar never stays the same, it just keeps rising..the materials & tools get better, look around you.

[joe]

Have you ever completed a job, proud of what you've done, and come back a couple of years later with maturity, and realize all the mistakes within. And how if you had it to do all over what you'd change.

That's what I call progress. It's that kind of humbling experience that affirms one's growth. It's like doing thumbnail sketches over one's lifetime. And it's frustrating, to me, there's no school or apprenticeship programs for this wonderful craft.

At one time I was hurt by the cruel words during critiques. While the late Aaron Siskind was gentle, for the most part, Arthur Siegel would take you apart. Ending up a with encouraging words like, "you can do better work than this or you wouldn't be here in the first place. Stop being so lazy. Now don't show up with this kind of **** again" These sessions called for dedication by all the students. And you didn't try to put anything over on these guys.

What we all need from time to time is hard, almost cruel, critiques of our work. I know I still yearn for it. But it's for the dedicated.

Joe Crumley

[Brian Harnett]

I have stuff out there that I cringe when I see it, hate to be even associated to it but my best work now is still not as good as some others.

[Ajcoholic]

Have you ever completed a job, proud of what you've done, and come back a couple of years later with maturity, and realize all the mistakes within. And how if you had it to do all over what you'd change.

Joe,
For me, that is each and every pc of furniture I build. Every single pc I do, I learn from and strive to do something just a little better on the next one. That too is something I learned from my father. Believe me, I am my worst critic. My OCD doesn't help matters, I want to redo everything I make, but obviously cannot.

You still cannot start at the top. Any form of crafting something, takes time and a lot of "doing" to get better and better. After 19 years now, doing custom woodwork - I am finally feeling like I know something. Finally... I figure in another 20, I will be not too bad and if I live long enough, by the time I get to my father's age (he will be 83 this year) I will consider myself "good" at it.