A couple of shop things and blades...

[harryball]

I hope I don't get tagged for being off topic... but I'd really like some wisdom and advice...

For one, I need to replace my compound sliding miter saw 10" blade and I need to select a "brand". My current Dewalt 80T blade is no longer viable to sharpen (so I'm told)

I'll buy a good blade either way and I know in many cases you get what you pay for... but I can only wonder if the Forrest blade is any better than my Delta Industrial blade on my tablesaw. I alternate usage while one is being sharpened. The Delta is being sharpened now. Using the tablesaw blind folded (figuratively) I couldn't tell the difference.

Next, shop security. Do you guys accept visitors open armed or do you steer them clear? This is more a request for experiences and shared life wisdom. People sometimes act very nosey and I'm wondering how you guys combat the people who may be casing the place. How do you tell them to "go away?"

I have an alarm system that is monitored, door locks, curtains etc... what else have people done to protect the valuable stuff like that $2500 spindle while your're away for a week or two?

Trailer storage and sheet goods. Do I need to let them sit in the shop a day or two or an hour or two before cutting? I'm planning to get a trailer to start hauling material and I want to leave it in the trailer reloading my shop rack as needed. Any cautions?

Sheet storage woes. I mainly use 1/2" ACX plywood and I've confirmed a strange phenomenom. If I store the sheet A down as it will be cut it tends to warp slighly up on the edges... if I store it A up (now I have to flip it to load) it still warps slightly up on the edges. It always crowns toward the bottom of the stack... even sheets 15 down. I've checked and double checked my rack and it is flat. In search of the "proper" method I stacked on different racks one A up, one A down and added 5 sheets of particle board on top of each... BOTH warped slightly edges up with the crown down. Are there some physics here I'm missing?

I now store the sheets so I have to flip to load and the vac table is a dream, sucks flat, holds well. Does anyone else have to do this? Suggestions on how to defeat it?


Robert

[beacon14]

What is the material and condition of the floor? The first thought that comes to mind is that the bottom of the stack is absorbing moisture from the floor. Not sure how that would affect the sheets other than the bottom sheet but if the bottom sheet is trying to warp and the others don't care they'll follow the one that is being stressed. What kind of rack are you using?

Trailer storage would concern me unless it's well ventilated. An enclosed trailer in Georgia can be used as a sauna (or a torture chamber) in the summertime.

[myxpykalix]

On shop security, here is what i do. I have a $79.00 color wireless digital camera hooked up to a spare Tivo I had here that records 100 hours at a time in 24 hour segments (approx) and running 24 hrs a day. You can buy one of these tivos for $50.00. So they will be on film before they even know it and the recording source is in the house so they can't steal that. I've never had a problem because there are only about 5 people who know i have tools in the shop and 4 are childen. The only other guy is Ed L. and believe me he can't run that fast (for obvious reasons if you saw him) so i'm not too worried about him! But i am of the thought that the fewer people you let know what you have the smaller the "suspect list" is if you get hit.

[fleinbach]

Robert,

In answer to your question about using a higher quality saw blade for a Dewalt sliding compound miter saw I will give you my experience. I have a Dewalt 12 inch sliding compound miter saw and replaced the blade with a Forrest 12 inch blade. After a while, we noticed the smell of burning rubber when using the saw. The Dewalt saw uses a belt drive to give you extra clearance for the blade. This appeared to be slipping causing the smell of burnt rubber. I switched back to a 12 inch Dewalt blade and the problem went away. My best guess is that the Forrest blade weighing about twice the weight of a Dewalt blade was too much mass for the motor to get spinning so the belt would slip on startup.

[ed_lang]

Hi Robert,

I have a DeWalt DW708 12" compound slider and love it. I run the DeWalt 60 tooth blades.

Security, my shop is 300' from the house. There is another shop behind me and folks across the road that are retired. A crook will get what he wants! Ask banks, they get hit too you know.

Visitors, I have a fair amount of traffic in my shop. Folks do like to look around and see nice equipment. That big blue machine in the main shop gets a lot of attention as well as the laser engraver. Most of my traffic is either locals or demo'ing the ShopBot. Of course all ShopBot visitors are no problem.... Well Jack did slip in :-)

Wood and storage - Trailer needs to be vented and I would not suggest it. I store rough sawn lumber in a shed roof off to one side of my shop. Covered and out of the rain, but not cold or humidity. Lumber is brought into the shop and given at LEST one week to stabalize before any cutting is done to it. My lumber rack/plywood rack allows all material to lay flat and long. NO plywood on the edge here unless it is on the way to the scrap pile! Your warp is due to moisture leaving the wood and causing it to draw up. Dry wood tightens up and wet wood relaxes. Get a pressure treated 2X4 that is straight, I know, that is a joke all by its own! Lay it in the sun and watch it draw up. Turn it over and watch it go the other way. OR, spray a scrap of ply with some water and watch it do the same thing. This is why you never veneer one side of any substrate, put a cheap something on the bottom when doing quality work.

Buy the best quality materials you can, store them flat and in a conditioned area if possible. Give your work time to get acclimated.

Ed

[harryball]

Too much fun, hard drive crashed last night about 10 minutes after my last post. whoohoo.

My floor is sealed concrete and both test stacks were 3" above the floor... moisture would be able to reach the bottom sheet and not the top sheet due to my overlay with particle board practice. I think I'll try a sheet of particle board on the bottom then stack the material and see what happens.

I build tilt bat poles from 16' 4x4 PT and when I purchase I bring them into the shop and sticker stack them for 2 weeks. It's amazing how nice they dry and stay straight. I did get in a rush one time, purchased the driest I could find and built the pole. The pole warped 3' off center after installation. Lesson learned the hard way.

Trailer or shipping container storage is going to be unavoidable at some point. It looks like I'm going to have to purchase a full unit of 1/2" ACX in the near future and I simply can't store 66 sheets along with everything else in my shop. It sounds like some solar fans for ventilation will do the trick. I can also have a roof over the trailer/container so the sun won't be on it directly.

To clarify, my saw is actually a Hitachi 10" compound slider, the blade is a Dewalt brand. It is belt driven, I hadn't thought about the extra weight issue. Sounds like I'll do just as well to spend a few bucks less for a good Dewalt or Delta Industrial.

I like the camera/TIVO idea. I don't mind invited visitors or people that I know stopping by, but believe it or not I get a few people that just drive up and knock on the door or walk in if it's open. If you saw my location you'd understand, we don't get door to door salesmen and in 27 years not a single trick or treator.

One problem is our neighbor, he has day workers coming and going and they decide our driveway is the right one then walk right in. I went in for a break and came back one time to find a guy wandering around the shop. I know it's hard to stop stuff like that except locking all the doors all the time... but I hate working in a lock down area.

A nice visible camera with "Smile, you're being recorded" in two languages might be a good touch. I also added a driveway alarm... it promply notifies me of every bird that flies by and misses the UPS truck.

Robert

[jamesgilliam]

Robert, I have tried different brands of blades and would stick with the Dewalt. Some of the ones I tried were heavier and caused parts to wear out faster, and cost me in replacing parts and somtimes machines. A thicker blade will have a wider kerf, take out more material, but take it's toll on motors and belts/gears over time.

As far as security, right now we are moving into our new shop. One end is framed out with offices (mine looks like a furniture storage room and Jo's like a big walk in closet), stained glass room, finishing room (currently the bedroom), bathroom and kitchen so security is not too big of a concern. Plus the neighbors have a big dog that lets you know if someone is around. I will probably do something later for the house when we build it, (about 15' from the shop) and include the shop too, I do like the camera and tivo idea for the shop, but would think you need a wireless camera to transmit the image to a hidden location for recording. So far visitors have not been a problem, but with time I'm sure we will get more. We are about 600' from the road (phone company loved that), and even people we know have a hard time finding our place. Jo-Anne has even missed the turn once or twice. Driveway alarm sounds good but I just can't see digging another 200' trench to the gate for the wire. Plus like you said I will know every bird and animal that comes through and miss the rest.

Wood storage is a big problem for me too. I bought a bundle of 1/2" plywood for the walls and put it on a plastic tarp right on the slab during our construction phase with no warping at all so far. Only ones that have warped have been the ones on the joists that are not screwed down yet. Humidiity and heat are the killers on any wood that is stacked.

[john_l]

i'd like more infor on the tivo setup jack. i thought you had to subscribe to get a tivo unit to work at all.

[myxpykalix]

What you need is a series 1 older tivo. I added a bigger harddrive. Go to Best buy, ect, check prices. I've seen them for $50.00(not lately though).

I bought a wireless camera from walmart that would transmit 300'. You might find better ones at security websites. It comes with the reciever that has a video/audio output that you connect rca cables to. I ran that to the input on the back of the tivo, set it to channel 100, program the recording time. If you set it to delete older programs it will record till it fills up then delete older programs to make room for new. As long as you don't have a problem you don't need to review what you record and just let it delete. If you get broken into make sure you don't delete that section. The nice thing is that the camera transmits to the tivo in the house so they can't steal the recording device because it is off the premises.
You need to make sure you have a fairly unobstructed line of site and I have set the camera on the bed of the bot to watch the cutting on long files like lithopanes but the metal bed does create some interference.
Let me know if you can't find a series 1 tivo I may have a couple extra ones around here, i'll have to check them out to make sure they work ok.
If you need more detailed info contact me off the forum and i'll see what i can dig up for you.

[knight_toolworks]

I have a makita scms and no problems with a 10" forrest. the saw is way too powerful a kickback on it is a very big deal. the forret blades cut very accuratly. I make cuts where there can be no error at all. they cut faster adn cleaner then anything else.

[harryball]

"the saw is way too powerful a kickback"

A saw blade with less than a 2 degree hook or negative hook will greatly reduce kickback or grabbing as I call it on a miter saw. In my early days I loaded up a regular old 10" blade from the orange home improvement store I'd been using on my table saw and started cutting. It was grabbing and tearing hunks of the wood out at times. I had to really hold on to the saw and clamp the board down to make any cuts. I just couldn't hold the board down with my hands... turns out while I did have a 60 tooth blade it had a very aggressive 10 degree hook. In the table saw it was a dream... on the miter saw it was a nightmare.

I use a 80 tooth blade with about 1 degree hook in general, it needs replacement. I have an 80 tooth blade with negative 5 degree hook I use for crown moldings and other light cut work. Both are dewalt and both are dead on accurate.

I don't doubt forrest blades are good, I have one... I've just not figured out if the price is worth it. Not the case going from Freud to Onsrud... the difference in cutting quality and ease was readily noticeable.

Robert

[randy]

Jack,

How about starting a thread on shop security and kicking it off with you great idea!

Slowly I turned...
Randy