New PRT Owner / dead controller driver

[fozzyber]

Hello I just bought A used PRT, circa 1999. (happy day!!!) I need to level and square her all up but I hooked every thing up and the X2 motor is not working,
I swapped some wires around and found that it is the #1 driver in the control box is DOA, not the motor. #1 driver will power up the motor but when a signal is sent to move the motor it vibrates / shimmy's but does not turn. My controller is a shop bot controls 2.06, can anybody give me some advice how to fix this, and how much?
I know before you say it buy a V4G, and that is in the plans but for now lets work with what I have. and the 2.06 controller does not have a 5th driver or dip switches so I can not go that route.

Thanks guys I just getting started, and have learned alot so far by lurking....



Jerry

[gerryv]

Jerry, Who sold it to you?

Many Shopbotters know other 'botters in their area. Perhaps if you indicate that, someone on the forum will know the machine and be able to offer better guidance.

[fozzyber]

the guy who sold it was Kevin B..... he bought it but never had it running or even really tried, he bought it from Highland millworks, (nang).
There are 3 bots I know of in my area, 2 are new alpha owners and one pst owner who is real good he was helping me yesterday, and one suggestion was to post up problem here, or to see if I could find a used driver. or new form SB

[hh_woodworking]

Call Shopbot and make sure your unit values are correct. That was the problem for me on a shutter. You can use the driver in the A slot to run the second motor. Shopbot can repair the board also

[fozzyber]

i will call about the unit numbers but, the 2nd x is fine and I don't think you can set them independently, or can you? (if so how?) as for moving the driver from the "A" slot, there is no driver in the A slot I had thought about that all ready.

Any idea where I can find a driver? and how much?

does anyone have unit values for a prt with 1.8 deg. full step motors.
or what the best way to calibrate, I have it close but not perfect.

thanks for the help so far guys?

jerry

[frank134]

try e-bay I got an extra for my alpha. good deal to.

[hh_woodworking]

need to know the number of teeth on the pinion gear to figure it. If I am thing right the drivers and solider on the boards. There are chips available and company's that will repair them. Or if you can afford it I would recommend the upgrade to the 4g board. Wow what a difference it the machine that will make. the drivers on that board are Geckos.

[cnc_works]

I experienced exactly the same problem when I purchased my similar vintage PRT. My solution was to use the extra driver on the board in place of the damaged one. And I used it that way for several years until I upgraded to a gecko controller. The guys at Shopbot should be able to guide you in the exchange just as they did me. Good luck.

[fozzyber]

UPDATED INFO:
like I said before there is no "exrta" driver on the board, the A slot is empty.
I moved the driver from X1 (slot 1) to the A slot (slot 5) and tried to move the accessory with VU setting of 200 for A and it did the exact same thing. (it just shutters). The driver I need is a plug in type IM481H any one knows where I can find one? does anyone have an old driver board they can snag one off of?

[gerryv]

Jerry, If you can't get a replacement, you might want to send a private message (PM) to Mike Richards on the forum. He's a stepper and driver guru and very helpful.

[Brady Watson]

Sounds like you have one of the 1st Gen PRTs with IMS (http://imshome.com/) drivers. I'd call ShopBot and find out if you can still get them. IMS drivers are vastly overpriced for what they are...It *may* be possible to replace or add a generic step & direction drive (like a Gecko or Chinese el cheapo variant) if in fact the IMS takes S&D signals from the SB board.

Otherwise - doing the 4G upgrade will slingshot your PRT into the 21st century & make it the tool you wished you had in the 1st place.

-B

[fozzyber]

Brady, you are correct, it is a IMS driver I'm trying to replace now.
I was reading some were here last night that a 4g might not be as good for me b/c of my high impedance motors? pk299-01aa.
any truth to this?
what should be my up grade path,? 4g then 7.2 motors?

thanks


Jerry



Sounds like you have one of the 1st Gen PRTs with IMS (http://imshome.com/) drivers. I'd call ShopBot and find out if you can still get them. IMS drivers are vastly overpriced for what they are...It *may* be possible to replace or add a generic step & direction drive (like a Gecko or Chinese el cheapo variant) if in fact the IMS takes S&D signals from the SB board.

Otherwise - doing the 4G upgrade will slingshot your PRT into the 21st century & make it the tool you wished you had in the 1st place.

-B

[ken_rychlik]

See if they still offer them here.
http://imshome.com/products/im481h.html

[fozzyber]

UPDATE:
Called ShopBot they told me to call IMS the MFG. for a new driver,
they have them in stock, $117 + $20 for over night,
sounds like a winner to me,
While I was talking to frank at SB, I asked about upgrading my controller,
He told me it would not do me a whole lot of good, with out upgrading the motors, :^( .. So I think the v4 upgrade is going to have to wait a little bit.
motors $450 ea x4 = $1800 + controller $1400 = $3200

Heck at that price I might as well look at upgrading to a alpha setup,
how much would that set me back?

[bleeth]

I believe current pricing on an Alpha upgrade is around $6600.00.

[fozzyber]

ouch, $6600 may be the std upgrade will be just fine.

[Brady Watson]

I agree. $117 is the path of least resistance, but you are still only 1/2 stepping with those IMS drivers, which means that you are not getting all the positional resolution that you could if you were running a microstepping (1/10) driver like a Gecko etc.

Just for reference your motors can easily be wired to a generic Gecko drive via Bipolar Series configuration. You could save a few bucks on the motors by building belt reduction boxes (3:1) yourself & keep the motors you have. In fact, there was a time when ShopBot shipped tools with belt reduction boxes and the exact same motors you have.

-B

[richards]

Jerry,

IF your motors have six wires, Black/Yellow/Green for the A-Phase and Red/White/Blue for the B-Phase, you can wire them half-coil and use Geckodrive G201x or G203v stepper drivers to control them. Wiring the motors half-coil and an 80VDC power supply will give you very respectable performance. When wired half-coil, the motors have 14mH inductance, which is still a little high, but usable. The Gecko stepper drivers are limited to 80VDC.

Contact Shopbot for pricing on the Geckodrives, or, buy them direct from www.Geckodrive.com (http://www.Geckodrive.com).

You will need to have TTL step/direction signals from your controller board. I'm not familiar with that board, so contact Shopbot for that information.

If you have 1" pitch diameter pinion gears, each of the 2,000 steps per revolution would move an axis 0.00157". 1.25 pitch diameter gears would give you 0.00196. (PI X pitch diameter / 2000)

Doing as Brady suggested and using a 3:1 belt-drive is an excellent way to get 3X better resolution and 3X more torque. I used 3:1 belt drives on my PRT-Alpha before buying the 7.2:1 geared motor upgrade that Shopbot offered to PRT-Alpha owners. The results from the belt-drives were visually identical to the results with the 7.2:1 geared motors.

Using Geckodrivers requires a lot of steps per second to get full usage. If your controller can't handle 25,000 steps per second, talk to Shopbot about a V20x controller card. The V201 card that Ted Hall sent to me was an excellent all-in-one controller. I used that card when building a 'contraption' for the San Mateo Maker Faire a few years ago to demonstrate how Shopbot software could control 'contraptions' other than CNC routers.

New PK296-F4.5A motors cost about $138 each. New PK299-F4.5A motors cost $208 each. Geckodrives are about $150 each. A power supply is about $150. I don't know the price for the Shopbot V20x controller, but I think that it was in the $300 to $400 range (including a sb3 software license).

If you decide to go the do-it-yourself route, send me a PM, and I'll try to help.

[fozzyber]

well new driver came in today, installed it and BINGO she is running, and made a few test cuts. Oh this is going to be fun. I can tell she is a little weak, got to fast and click click click, lost steps, but hey you don't know the line if you don't cross it. I think I'll make some parts, get used to her, then see how strong I want to go,

thanks so far...

Will keep you updated....


Jerry