Experience With Aspire to Build Occasional Kitchens?

[gerryv]

Anyone out there that has experience using Aspire to build occasional cabinet sets such as full kitchen with island; for example a few a year so that the learning curve for cabinet software is not practical? Also because we want to learn Aspire well first before even thinking about learning a second program at the same time.

Questions that come to mind are:
1. Is it even very practical?
2. If we do a a second or a few sets can the initial files be modified to save time or is it really more of a start from scratch situation each time?
3. Recognizing that doors, drawers, etc., can be outsourced at good prices, is Aspire still practical is we think we want to do the whole job in house?
4. Assuming we never went over say four to six sets a year in the first year or two while we wanted to stick with only Aspire would we be doing ourselves as dis-service?
5. Assuming number two is a positive and these "template" files can be easily modified, are there other shopbotters out there who would sell people like me a set of modifiable files at a fair and reasonable price as I would certainly expect to pay for quality?

[srwtlc]

For just a few now and then, a good table saw/sliding table is quick. No need to draw anything up for toolpathing.

That said, there's no reason one couldn't become proficient at it with Aspire. If you drew up a library of parts (saved as eps, dxf, ai) and toolpathed them accordingly and saved those toolpaths as templates, you could load the parts through the import vectors and apply the toolpaths by loading the proper toolpath template. If you have a group of parts that you commonly do, just make it a native Aspire file that you could modify as needed. Don't forget that Aspire will nest parts on sheets too.

It would take some time to get it all set up and be quick at it, but once you did, it would work.

Another option would be to use a cut list program that would output dxf sheet layouts that you could import into Aspire and then load toolpath templates. For example, CutList Plus. http://cutlistplus.com/

[gene]

For a set once in a while i would look at cabinet parts pro that Ryan sells. the cost can be re-cooped on the first set , easy to set up, very easy to learn.

[adrianm]

Aspire is probably overkill for just the occasional cabinet job unless you've got a lot of custom 3D. I'd go with VCarve/Partworks.

[gerryv]

Thanks much guys for the input. I already have Aspire so not an issue there. Really would like to stay away from a second program, however easy for most people though due to a brain injury disability that presents atypical challenges - understanding etc still is just fine but remembering and organizing information in the ol' noggin is very limited so the question really needs to remain whether or not Aspire - on it's own - addresses the initial questions. Thanks for understanding.

[bob_s]

I used aspire to make 8 or 9 cabinets then two large entertainment centers. It works great for the details but it isn't parametric so when you resize a cabinet tour dado width changes etc. try using cabinet parts pro and use Aspire to create your details like pilasters etc
I find the two programs work very well together.

[dlcw]

The most difficult part of incorporating joinery is the varying thicknesses of material. Even buying 5 sheets of plywood out of the same lot will result in varying thickness. The way to deal with this is to set Z to the table surface and not the material surface. Once you get all your joinery and cutouts done, having used table surface as ZZero will make things work.

Aspire does squares and rectangles really well. In a kitchen, or any other cabinetry, you are pretty much doing squares and rectangles.

Making libraries of different parts that you can resize to fit the needs of the current job is a great idea. Bring them into the kitchen project as you need them, resize, make any modifications, nest and you should be ready to go. This works for incorporating hardware holes too.

The biggest challenge will be doing flip operation. Everything on your table has to be dead on perfect aligned to do flip operations reliably (don't ask how I know this :rolleyes:). When making mortise and tenon joinery thousands of an inch make a difference in a well fitting joint or a poor fitting joint. ECabinets can be a pain in the butt to figure out and learn, but flips ops is an area it does really well in.

[bleeth]

You can do it with partworks! We have been doing all our cabinet sides this way for a long time and although I use Artcam the system is the same. So many typical cabinets are repeated from job to job that you will get to use the same ones over and over. You start with a few basic "library" parts. I have a file that is a rectangle that is 7" long and double the width of my hinge setback that has two hole in it and that is basic hinge drilling guide. I have another that is a long line of holes for the shelf drilling. I made layouts of a drawer space with the drilling for the slides in them.
So for a 30" high x 13" deep upper box I just draw the box, put in the hinge template by snapping the corners, select an appropriate number of holes and center them, copy and paste them to 1 3/4" from the cab back, and place a rectangle 30.5 x .26 3/4" from the back. I then save that as a 30 x 16 upper.

For a base cab with two doors I do basically the same thing, but move one of the hinges down 3/16 and this is the upper end. then mirror it for the other side, so one is a left and one is a right side. By the time you are on the second or third one you find that you can modify existing cabinets in a few seconds to create new ones. Each type gets saved in your library and then when it comes time to layour your actual sheet you just cut and paste it in and block copy as needed.

The operator will cut the parts that don't need machining (stretchers, nailers, backs,bottoms and tops) on the saw while the sides are cutting and our total output is 30 plus sheets in a day on a tool that is set to cut at 3ips.

We use butt joinery and will staple and then back up with screws all sides and then post laminate finished ends. For assembling from material that we don't want to do that (Like quality maple ply) we'll use a kreg jig and pocket screw them together.

[gerryv]

Thanks guys for the good info and insight. Those experience based hints and wisdom could save me a heck of a lot of pain and learning the hard way so it's much appreciated.

We have a Felder Euro combination machine with an 8' slider which would for sure give us the cut accuracy and speed but the thought is that because we have Aspire but are just beginning to learn it, a real project would make the learning curve more interesting. To be honest, the thought is kind of scary but the first two sets of cabinets would be our own. Then again, that means meeting the approval of the executive director, my good wife, hmm.

[gene]

Hi Gerald,
I also have a felder 700 s with a 8 ' slide and it is fast and very accurate. you owe it to yourself to download Ryans cabinetpartspro and try it out . Its very easy to set up and then all you do is enter the dimensions and type of cabinets you want and it will do all the cut files nested on sheets that are numbered. If you want or need help setting it up i would be glad to help. i have used this and i like it alot.

[gerryv]

Hi Gene, really appreciate that; I'll definately get back to you. Right now my world has temporarily come to a stop because I'm watching the iPhone 5 intro... haha, that should get this thread hijacked in a hurry ;)

[Ryan Patterson]

Gerald,
You may be interested in this http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15997 (http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15997).

[gerryv]

Hi Gene,
I took your advise and just sent in a registration request. Good to see another Felder user here. Ours is a CF741SP. If we had to do it again, we would probably go with separate jointer/planer and slider/shaper units.
Tks again,
Gerry