UPS Battery Backup?

[rb99]

I have searched but no luck. Are UPS backups recommended and if so how big, what setup?

I am looking to protect from those power flickers that happen sometimes.

[ron_moorehead]

I run one on all my computers in the shop. I don't have one on the ShoBot it self but on the last power bumps we had the bot kept running through the minor power bump until I could shut it down. I got mine at Costco I think they are the 1500 va ones. I also have one on the desktop shopbot I have and tested it out running the spindle and moving the carriage around and it worked fine said I had about 5 minute of power left on the battery during the testing. By installing the UPS I also increased my connection speed from about 72% up to 80%.

[ssflyer]

Yep - a good UPS makes a great line filter...

[dana_swift]

I will chime in on this one..

Rons (Sloan) commented about the UPS as a line filter. Yes indeed. A REAL UPS is about the best line filter you can get.

There are two kinds of units a "UPS" and a "SPS".

A UPS (Uninterpretable Power Supply) is a system where the load runs off an inverter 100% of the time. There is a battery charger/maintainer which supplies the inverter and batteries to keep them charged. This kind of unit is more expensive than a SPS. It will interrupt itself when the batteries run down, but they are intended to get a generator online and start recharging the batteries. The load is on the inverter 100% of the time, or its not a UPS.

A SPS "Standby Power System" is an inverter with a relay so when the power goes off, it quickly switches the inverter on, and it takes over the load. The load runs off the utility power almost 100% of the time and the battery charger/maintainer is very tiny since it does not need to be able to supply the load also.

A SPS is not as good as a UPS, but costs a lot less. What you would purchase at a office supply is most likely a SPS.

It is possible to purchase either a UPS or SPS large enough to keep the entire shopbot running but probably, though its not cost effective for most people. Backing up the computer like Ron (Moorehead) does is a great compromise. A very small unit will backup the control computer and allow you to note the line to continue the cut on when the power comes back. The SPS or UPS lets you shutdown the computer and save your files.

A very small unit will do the computer protection job for a very reasonable cost.

One alternative to all this is use a laptop computer with a good battery as the control computer. It is a UPS built-in. The charger keeps the battery going, and the battery keeps the computer going. No glitch when the power goes out. The Shopbot however is another story.

D

[cowboy1296]

I know this is a 2 year old post, but truth is i did not know what a ups was until about a month ago. I live in the sticks and we have more than our share of power blips. Generally they are only for a few seconds, but enough to shutdown the computer, loose your zero and shut down the the shopbot buddy. So i am assuming that the ups would keep my computer live. I am also assuming that the buddy would still be running, but i would imagine putting it into a pause and noting line, x, y and z would be important. that way when the power is restored i could continue where i left off. Now tell me where i am wrong and if not what unit would be best for the buddy.

[Brady Watson]

All true, but there is a caveat...You want some mechanism in place to pause the machine if the power goes out. It takes a lot of power to run the router and drive motors, plus computer. Go with the largest UPS you can afford if you aren't able to get to the machine right away.

The UPS will also buffer the power in your building and smooth out line ripple. Think of it as a big drum of electricity, with your line power pouring in at 60 pumps per second. If gravity fed from the bottom of the drum, there is no ripple...which is a good thing for electronics. UPS would be good as a line conditioner if you planned on running your bot off of a genny...and some generators have a line conditioner built in now.

It would be possible to setup your tool with a relay that monitored a small electrical load that was connected to the main power of the shop. On input (power goes out & relay tripped), the machine could be told to pause, shutting down all movement and power to the router. There are probably other solutions to this, but this is what immediately comes to mind.

-B

[cowboy1296]

Thanks. My Buddy is setup in the corner of my garage and i only cut when i am home. I can only guess that the bot would not have to run more than a minute before i could get to it and hit the pause button.

Like i said earlier i am really just learning about the ups.

[maverickx50]

I went with a CyberPower PR2200LCD. Its probably a bit overkill but we intend to take the desktop to craft shows etc. Never know how clean or stable the power might be. My testing shows that with my laptop, desktop, and 60 watt light plugged in ill get close to 30 min. Of run time after a power failure I'm running a spindle not an add on router. Even at home its comforting to know I have a good clean consistent true sign wave power supply to the Bot. A bit expensive, close to $800. Best price was found on Amazon

http://www.cyberpowersystems.com/products/ups-systems/smart-app-ups/pp-series/pr2200lcd.html

[cowboy1296]

I am still in a learning curve Maverick. My buddy plugs into a 20 amp circuit. So does your model plug into a 20 amp circuit or 15.

[cowboy1296]

I spoke with cyber power this morning. Of course the guy did not know what a cnc router was which is ok because i dont know what a ups is. but i am learning. This is the model that plugs into a 20 amp circuit. CyberPower OR2200PFCRT2U.
Before i drop 400 on this can someone tell me where i might be messing up.

The weather here is clear and beautiful and we have not had a storm in days. But while i was typing this there was a blip in the power and my new desktop ups kicked in for the first time. This would have shut the bot down had it been running.

[scottp55]

Rick,
Just for info we're running both Desktops with the Cyberpower 1500 and spindle. DT never once cutout during numerous small outages that kill oven clocks and regular tower.
For longer than a blip or a thunderstorm, we just pull power to UPS/pause cut and kill spindle power and can sit out a 45 minute thunderstorm before we have to shut down computer.
20A dedicated 110V.
scott

[cowboy1296]

Well right or wrong i just bought the CyberPower OR2200PFCRT2U

[gerryv]

Very likely you're more right than wrong :-)

[cowboy1296]

thats what i use to tell my x wives, but they did not buy into it.

[cowboy1296]

of course i still dont have my ups yet. I get different answers from tech support at cyberpower. the last message from them they told me to get the PR2200LCDRT2U and indicated that it would run the buddy for 3 minutes. I would like to think that i could get more out of it. Anyhow I contacted amazon about the unit that i have already ordered. Their claim is that i can test it and if it does not work then exchange it for the larger unit. If i get the results that i am hoping for with either unit i will make a video and post the link on here.

[maverickx50]

Like I mentioned I have the PRT2200LCD. crunching the spec numbers it says it will run my desktop for about 7 min. After hooking it all up and monitoring the real current draw it is obviously capable of more than 30 min of run time . Likely due to less real draw than the equipment is spec to. Bet you find the same reality with the unit you ordered. One note its a big darn battery with a bunch of electronics attached. Very heavy. Plan on not moving it or having it attached with good casters to your router system

[cowboy1296]

Thanks. I think that i get the unit Friday which will give me the weekend to play with it.

[cowboy1296]

Regarding the weight, i have a furniture mover around here not being useful. Not that i plan to run it with a load for more than a short period of time, naturally i am interested how it will take a load.

[cowboy1296]

Holly batman Maverick, you were right about the weight. I had a rush order come it so it may be later in the week before i can test it.

[cowboy1296]

I got the chance to test the UPS, model CyberPower OR2200PFCRT2U today. I know that there is a learning curve for CyberPower tech support, but the unit I ordered seems to do the trick when they wanted me to order a bigger unit.

I am in the process of doing a small 3d test cut. My test cuts were not air cuts but actual cutting into cherry wood. My computer, my monitor and buddy (porter cable router) are all plugged into the ups. During roughing the rpm is set at 10 k and I noticed that when I unplugged the ups everything worked fine but the rpm.s dropped substantially. So for future ref I will run the roughing at 13k.

I run finishing at 16k. When I unplugged the ups there was a slight decrease in the rpm but nothing like I saw in the roughing tool path. I unplugged the ups at least twice and it never missed a beat. Perhaps a slight decrease in rpms but not much. The second time that I let it run with ups power, it ran for 6 minutes and there was still battery power left.

I still have a learning curve myself with the ups, but so far I am very happy. It was never intended to run the buddy, even though that was one of my tests. It is mostly just for those pesky momentary power blips that we get in the country..

[maverickx50]

Every thing I read here leased me to believe that shopbots controllers are quite sensitive to any anomalies . That said the power curve supply will be more consistent moment to moment than your likely getting from your utility supply. I'm betting you will have fewer unexplained glitches than you would even if you never have a short outage.

[cowboy1296]

Just a followup on the ups. I cant tell you how many times it has saved my butt from a power failure. Most of the time the glitches in power are so quick that you would not normally notice, but the shopbot would have. I never bought it to run the buddy but just to give me the time to run to the garage to shut it down properly.