Need Help with Spindle Speed Control

[Mark Farris]

Hey all,
I do several production runs a year of a particular product. I am currently running my first run on my "new to me" PRS Alpha w/spindle instead of my former PRT w/ PC router. The cutting file cuts a series of holes and pockets and jogs to a resting place out of the way to change parts, then I run it again 30 to 40 times per run. On my PRT I would simply turn on the PC router and click on repeat each time to cycle through the parts. Now that I have an Alpha the spindle shuts off when it gets to the end as it should, I change parts, click repeat, re-start the spindle, and run again. The question: Is there a way to, after starting the spindle, have it remain on until all parts are run, then have it shut off? I am currently using the arcs/inches w/speed post-processor. I suppose I could use the arcs/inches (without speed) but I'm not sure how to turn the spindle on and off manually. Suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Mark

[Brady Watson]

Mark,
No - that cannot be easily done. I am not clear why you would want to have the spindle remain on between toolpaths - can you elaborate on that?

You *could* comment out with an apostrophe any line, except for the last one that reads, SO,1,0 by changing it to 'SO,1,0

You can turn the spindle on & off in Keypad mode by toggling Output #1.

Thanks!
-B

[Mark Farris]

Brady,
Since the file cutting time is just 15 seconds plus or minus it just seemed like a lot of unnecessary starting and stopping of the spindle. I would think there is more wear and tear in starting and stopping rather than just running with no load, but I really have no idea. Since it is well documented by one of the most experienced contributors here on the forum (you) that HSD spindles are basically "throw-away", I was just trying to keep the wear and tear to a minimum.

Mark

[srwtlc]

Mark,

If I understand you, you're not running a different toolpath each time, but are repeating the same toolpath over and over until you're done.

If so, edit your part file to comment out, with an apostrophe (delete if you want) the SO,1,0 at the end of your file just before the PAUSE and GOTO REPEAT you must have there. Now, when it has moved out of the way and is in PAUSE, the spindle will keep running. When you are done with the run and you cancel the PAUSE instead of continue, the spindle will shut off. This is something I do often for files that I repeat or loop over an over until I'm done.

If you are saying that you are reloading the file each time with something like ctrl-R, then it won't and you need to edit your file to make it a true repeating file.

[Brady Watson]

Mark,
Just open up your SBP with the FE command and comment out (or delete) all commands that read "SO,1,0" and your spindle should stay on. You may also have to delete the last few lines including the "END" statement to keep it running.

FYI - I also run an HSD here. It's not the same as the Colombo - but she gets the job done. When that one dies I have no qualms about buying another one or trying out a Chinese one. I really don't care what's hanging on the Z as long as it doesn't bog down or let me down when making a living. I'm sure you'll agree. Since HSD doesn't repair them, they are 'throw aways' - I know nobody wants to hear that, but sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to make them start rebuilding them. Just throw a couple of bucks in the 'replacement spindle' kiddie when you do a job & it will never be an issue. I did that & now I have a spare 5hp & VFD on the shelf ready to go should the need arise. It's a pay it forward kinda thing...

-B

[bleeth]

I love my Columbo-10 years and not a dimes worth of maintenance!:D
Paid for itself many times over. I really don't think SB has done itself well by pushing the HSD for production clients.

[Mark Farris]

Thanks Guys,
Scott - It is the same file and I think that will work for me. I've just started editing files and am still learning. Tonight I have learned to "comment out" from both you and Brady, and now the PAUSE and GOTO REPEAT. I'm going to give that a try tomorrow.

Brady - The HSD comment was just kidding. I know you have strong opinions and I respect them greatly. I'm always interested in what you have to say.

Dave - Always good to hear from you and your opinions too. My PRT finally went down the road today, sorry to see her go but I love the Alpha. Thanks again for taking time to look at it with me. You doing a camp this year at the new place?

Mark

[srwtlc]

Mark, in case you haven't looked at it, take a look at the programming handbook in the ShopBot folder or with 'HP' in SB3. If you run jobs like this often and use version 3.8.X, it might be worth looking into the PAUSE UNTIL command and set up a momentary button on an input for repeating instead of going back to the keyboard each time.

Programming handbook excerpt....

PAUSE UNTIL works just like PAUSE (without a time) except that an Input Switch can be used as the equivalent of the OK input button. For example, programming PAUSE UNTIL 5, 1 will PAUSE until the OK button is entered or the #5 Input Switch is closed. Any message in a preceding comment line will be displayed as with the simple PAUSE instruction. Use a 0 to detect an Input Switch opening, or 1 to detect a Switch closing.
By default, when motion is initiated after an Input Switch PAUSE, there will be a warning and short wait, just like at the beginning of a file to provide a safety interval. This can be eliminated by turning the wait off with [SW] before the call to function, then restoring it. There is a sample file in the SbParts folder (sample_for_switch.sbp) that illustrates.

[Mark Farris]

Scott,
After much trial and error it worked perfect. Like I said I haven't worked very much with editing files and it took me awhile to figure out I had to add a "label" with a colon (REPEAT:) where I wanted to re-start the file with the PAUSE and GOTO REPEAT commands at the end where I deleted the command to stop the spindle. Learn something new every day. Thanks.

I haven't been successful with the 3.8.xx control software yet. I have had a lot of the "slow down" problems as others have had. Ted and staff have worked with me and my program to try to fix it but we have been unsuccessful, so for now I am back to 3.6.44 and have no problems.

Mark

[bleeth]

Not this year. Before Bill was unceremoniously ushered out the door we talked about it being time for a change. But my door is always open to anyone who would like to stop by.
A timely thread-I've been doing a repetitive cut job for someone on a regular basis. When he only needed a few sheets at a time it was no big deal but his business is getting bigger and now the numbers are getting large enough that I was thinking yesterday I needed to modify the file to do just that.Speed and spindle on/off won't work on my older Delta VFD but just pressing enter once instead of 3 times between each sheet would be an improvement.

[Mark Farris]

Dave, understood about the camp. I'm sure it's a lot of work.

With Scott's help this process is down to a one click repeat. Are you saying your Columbo isn't controlled from within the cut file?

Mark

[bleeth]

Yes. Frank, Scott, Ryan, and I went crazy trying to figure out why it wouldn't work. I bought the "add-on" one when Ryan first came up with it and then they replaced it with the latest one when I upgraded to the new Alpha Controller. Neither works. Finally GC mentioned to me that he had come across a few older Delta VFD's that they just won't work on. One thing I haven't done is get a hold of the supplier direct. It's on my list, but no biggee since the controller is on the wall right next to the computer and I'm not thrilled with the idea of it turning on and off between every sheet we cut anyway. I'd also, of course, have to get used to the idea of needing to make sure the initial speed is set how I want it in every toolpath and at this point I don't even look at that.