Got Chatter?

[propellers]

Running our SB with the PC #75182 six hours a day we wear out routers due to what we though was armature wear, bearing wear, or upper bearing mount wear that our Dealer, that repairs our tools said is not sold by PC.
We cut 3D and used a 3.5” overall length two flute Bosh Cutter with Hard Maple at cut speeds of 2.5” ips at various router speeds. After three router brush changes the collet has noticeable slop of what we thought was normal wear/life of the routers.
This weekend I was doing a brush change I noticed when moving the bit back and forth it was not what we were told as unrepairable. On this particular router I found the upper bearing mount being loose. This bearing mount has two screws that hold the bearing mount to a plastic case. I tightened these screws and no more play at the collet/router bit, no bit chatter and the router sounds and cuts as if it were new. The dozen routers we have around here that we were told by our repair facility were worn out I found all had a loose upper bearing mounts. Looks like new router sales will be less for our PC Dealer!

Another thought I have always wanted to try but could never find the time and hope someone else may have time to work out is having the option of different router speed changes controlled in the software using a PC #75182.

Using the SO command I can turn the router on and off. If the multi speed switch on the router has a direct wire to each speed which is normally manually selected could be controlled by SO commands using multiple switches, the same I use for the on/off control but wired for different SO commands. I don’t see why we could not have program controlled speeds. Any thoughts?

[gc3]

you need to get a spindle...

[propellers]

you need to get a spindle...

Just wanted to let others know what I found that could assist in trouble shooting a possible problem with chatter.

Like to run a spindle but I read on the forum of the issues with how fragile they are so I will stay with the routers. The PC routers on our PRT have been cutting excellent, inexpesive and been reliable for us since the days of the cable machine. Even though the employees have worked/abused the routers harder than they were meant to be the only problems we have are worn brushes, and a few worn bearings and now I found the problem with play I'm even more pleased. Of course they are noisy but we wear noise canclling headsets so we can still listen to the tunes.

Not a problem to manually changing speeds on the fly but just thought of the possibility. Thanks for the reply.

[gc3]

Like to run a spindle but I read on the forum of the issues with how fragile they are so I will stay with the routers.


really...IMHO a spindle works/performs beyond a 75182 in a production setting...

[Simops]

What Gene says.......if you are doing production level output it is worth getting a spindle. I don't do anywhere the level of production output you do......but I have a spindle and love it. Had it now for 4 years and it's rock solid and reliable.

Cheers

[adrianm]

Spindles aren't fragile at all, not sure who's been saying that. If they were why do 99% of production CNC shops run them?

I've been running mine since 2009 and it's still going strong.

I always make sure to ramp into cuts rather than plunging but other than that I make no concessions and run it just as I would a router but with the benefits of controllable speed, much less noise and consistent torque.

[cowboy1296]

Thanks a lot Lonnie for the info. A router is just fine for me since this is more of a hobby than anything. I primarily do 3-d in black walnut and cherry and it seems that I am wearing my brushes out way to fast. So this gives me something to look at. The last time I ordered brushes I ordered 6 sets so that there would be no down time.

I have never done 3-d in maple and would like to see some of your work if you want to post it.

[hh_woodworking]

When I first got my machine I ran the router at High RPMs. Then Bill told me to run it at 10,000 rpm and most of the cutting could be run at this rpm. I starting doing that and the brushes lasted 2 years after that. Most of the cutting on 3d is fine cuts lowering the rpm will also lower the noise level a lot. Try it and see the difference

[cowboy1296]

I have been at 10k for a while now but still wear out my brushes way too soon, speaking of which it is time to check them.

[paul_z]

Lonnie,

Thanks for taking the time to share your discovery. I'll check my PC routers.

The speed control on the PC router is not very accurate nor stable under load. I'd also worry that you may introduce a new source of rf noise.

Still, it might be worth a try. Do you have unused output discretes?

Paul Z

[propellers]

Thanks guys, hope the information helps possible cut issues when needed.

Rick you asked to see some pictures of our work, check out our Photo Gallery.

http://princeaircraft.com/PhotoGallery_Index.aspx

http://princeaircraft.com/

Paul, I don't have any extra discretes.

[Joe Porter]

http://www.vhipe.com/product-private/SuperPID-Home.htm Lonnie, I don't know if this is any interest to you or not, but it is a router speed control that can be controlled from Mach. Whether it will work with ShopBot control, I don't know...joe

[propellers]

Thank you for the information, I am interested in having a constant speed/torque at slower speeds. I posted a question to the company and to SB Tech. to see if the speed can be controlled in the SB software or only SO on/off commands. Either way if the speed is constant at low rpm's then it's worth a purchase.

Is anyone using this unit on their router? http://www.vhipe.com/product-private/SuperPID-Home.htm

FYI...In our shop some of us use the new Bose Noise Canx ear buds, some use a full coverage noise canx headset. The Bose ear buds $300.00 are great and can be used even without a music input. When I first used them I turned on the dust collection system because it was so quite and didn't realize it was already running, even use them when the wood planer is running and again as good as the ear defenders. As a bonus I use them when sleeping or napping to reduce/eliminate noise like my spouse snooring(I'll pay for that one) outside wind, cars etc...can't believe how I wake up rested anymore.

I heard of a system that was going to be built for airports that would noise canx jet engine noise by using large speakers..don't know how this reasearch is going if at all but has anyone heard of a smaller system that could be used in shops to reduce shop noise?

[David Iannone]

I took Bill P suggestion a while back also and started using 10k on my PC and also enjoy lower noise. My dust collection is louder. Although I cut mainly sign foam and soft plastics. More chips and less fine power.