Need some help with a V Carve lettering alignment problem?

[James Schlatre]

Looking for some help to see what I am missing. 2007 PRS Alpha 96-60-14 using Software Version 3.5.1 on a XP machine (this version came with the machine see no reason to change that). Still a novice at this so bare with me please, Using V Carve 8 Pro I am making an Air Force insignia for my father’s (he is 80) reunion. I have the clip art down loaded it works fine, what I keep having trouble with is the V Carve lettering around the clip art. As you can see in the picture (if I got them loaded right) it keeps cutting too far to the left and not lining up when it finishes at the right. I'm sure it is the operator and not the machine. I am also not sure what file you might want to see, the before it was tool path or after please let me know and I will gladly post it?
I did talk to Ryan at Shopbot last Friday hope to hear back with anything they see tomorrow.

Thanks for reading James

[scottp55]

James,
I'd also post this on the Vectric forum, as there you can attach the .crv (if less than 2mb--Zip or delete extra toolpaths if needed) and the guys usually help pretty fast.
Are you centering the font on the central graphic, or on one of the circle vectors....Is it a true circle made from scratch, or bitmap traced with a ton of nodes?
Is that how it looks in preview?
Perhaps group fonts, and then try centering on a different vector OR simply Nudge > until it looks and measures right.
scott

[James Schlatre]

Scott I did it both ways , bitemap traced and from scratch. Yes it is a true circle and it measure out round. I have no problem with the clip art or the circle. I will post the tool path with the V carve lettering and circle .

[scottp55]

It LOOKS as if you could just select all the font, group, and then center on your outermost circle.
Forgive if preaching to the choir, but I would select ALL and copy/paste into NoMansLand or onto another layer OR save it as a different date/# before tweaking it to heck and gone, so you always have the original to come back to...Just in case you have to convert to curves and node edit something.
Hope someone else chimes in! In Vectric forum someone will probably tweak it for you and send a .crv back, BUT it will most likely be a VCP8 file.

[James Schlatre]

Thanks for the input Scott, I have to set up an account for the Vectric forum waiting to be approved.

[scottp55]

Good James,
They're a VERY helpful bunch, and as friendly as the this forum.
IF you're in a rush, you can email file to me(under my contact info) and I'll be happy to putz with it, BUT better on Vectric as you get multiple opinions and I learn better ways to draw and shortcuts almost every day.
If NOT VCP8, then you may want to mention the version you're running or you won't be able to open the file. Many (like me with VCP7.5) have kept an older version for occasions like that.
Good luck.
scott

[James Schlatre]

Update
Scott, I have not been able to get on the Vectric Forum yet, registered last Monday and still have not received a email back from an administrator to approve my account . Also have not heard back from Shopbot support. I did send this same info to the Vectric support site and received an answer back from Mark and from what he saw in the file everything looked fine (whew). He thinks it looks like I lost some steps and it may be a mechanical problem with wiring to a stepper motor. So after doing a search on the site for stepper motors, I will put some of the learned information to good use when I get to the house tonight. Thanks for your insight Scott.

[scottp55]

No problem James,
Though if it's lost steps and electronics....I'm the LAST person to help you:)
Keep us posted and let us know what it was once it's resolved.
Good luck,
scott

[James Schlatre]

Update:
After hearing back from Vectric that it was not what I was doing in the program, I turn my focus back to the forum . After reading some of the other related problems I did the following.
I redid the layout from scratch, got a new laptop and loaded the software that came with the machine ( software Version 3.5.1, Firmware Version 1.06). Ran a speed test only getting 68.1%, I replaced the USB to Serial with a new IOGEAR USB to Serial RS-232 Adapter along with adding a self powered port getting it to 83.1% communication.
Still having the same problem when I V Carve around the circle of it not lining up, missing steps as I understand it. I did notice I made the zero on the center of the design and ran 3 difference files, each was difference V Carve in the same circle (also ran them as a combine fine same results). What I notice is when it returns to the x,y,z zeros it is not quite in the same position. See the attached pic, I marked from the outer circle to the top of the letter how far off it gets. Hoping to get feedback and opinions of what might be happing.
PRS Alpha 97-60-14 HSD 2.5 HP 2007 model
X unit value 2482.8171, Y unit value 2482.8171, Z unit value 2979.3805
Model Vexta ASM98AA-T7.2 motors
Thanks James

[ron_moorehead]

Have you check your pinion gears to see if they are loose. Have you replaced your pinion gears at all, you stated you have a 2007 model depending on how much use it has gotten the gears should be replaced every year or couple of years. With the control box turned on, try and move the X and Y carriage by hand and see if their is any movement. The other test you can do is drop the motors out of the rack and move the carriage around and make sure it moves freely and all the wheels stay on the track.

[Brady Watson]

What are your cut speeds? As in: XY,Z speeds?

Open up the SBP and look for the line near the top that says something like: MS,1.99,1.49 etc. What are the red numbers?

You want to make sure you are running at reasonable speeds when v-carving. There's a lot more going on there than you'd think. Lower your speed to 1.2,0.7 and see if that fixes the alignment problem. If you are running at 'stupid speeds' at the default values in the tool database (like 6,6), then you are doomed to failure. Pull those speeds back to the numbers I suggest and see if that fixes it.

-B

[James Schlatre]

Brady Thank you for your reply,

I had a fellow Shopbot'er Stan Holt (He has been on the forum for years) come by and look at things. We looked at all the motors and alignments. What we came up with is if I select a bit other the 90 deg V Carve we lose steps. If I pick a 90 deg bit all works fine, cuts great and returns to the zero. Stan slowed the ramp speeds way down and we ran a 60 deg and you can tell where it starts to lose steps, and never returns to the right zero. So we deleted that file made a new one by coping the 90 deg file that worked and changed it to 60 deg, but had the same problem. We change it to 58, 45, 89 deg and still it is off. Only works right when set on a 90 deg V bit. All other measurements and alignments seem to be working fine. I built the file in V Carve 7.5 & 8.0, also sent the cut file to Stan for him to run on his shopbot , ran fine for him with no problems.

Frank from Shopbot ask "Are you and Stan running the same version of the control software? If not upgrade to the most current version." No we're not, Last time I try to update the software it took on a mind of its on and tried to drill the Z Zero plate thru the base. So I clean and reinstall the original software and it all cleared up.

Question in my mind is why does it cut like it should when selecting a 90 deg v bit, but if I select a 60 deg v bit it will lose steps and will not return to the correct zero? Am I wrong to think that I have the original software/firmware that came with the machine so it should do the basic 90-60 or whatever deg of bit you select right? I am sure I am missing the obvious.

Thanks for your time

[srwtlc]

What feed rate/plunge rate is being used for each bit? If you happen to have a rate that is too high, you could loose steps with the abrupt direction changes involved in V-carving. If the rates are different, try matching them or slowing them down and see what happens. You can also soften the way V-carving is done by adjusting the 3D ramp threshold (I like 80 for most V-carving) and also slow corner speed (maybe 50).

[James Schlatre]

Stan was running a newer version on the software then I was, Frank suggested I upgrade the software/firmware. Only version for my bot was the 3.6.48, so for seems to have worked I will do more testing. Whew!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks James