doing things the other guys wont/cant...

[Ajcoholic]

Just a simple thing to show others. Although I am a predominantly woodworker (meaning I generally work with wood and wood veneers) I am trying to get a bit of the melamine work here in my area. Lots of people like the lesser expensive melamine for storage cabinetry, laundry room stuff, etc.

Instead of just making things the same as the other guys, I want to be able to offer more unique and better built product.

Two examples, this tray (I did some for a kitchen retrofit) which has the front cut out on the CNC, and then edge banded with a portable glue pot edge bander. The other guys in town offer square screwed together boxes only. I also CNC the groove for the 5/8" bottom which is rabbeted and glued in. The case was Lamello'd but in the future will be dowelled with my new boring machine.

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j307/ajcoholic/IMG_0860_zpsdz74ztmq.jpg (http://s83.photobucket.com/user/ajcoholic/media/IMG_0860_zpsdz74ztmq.jpg.html)

And for a recent closet job, I cut the corner shelving on my Shopbot and also edge banded the interior radius with the portable bander. A small touch but the customer loved it and the other guys dont do this.

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j307/ajcoholic/IMG_0802_zpsnzjs3pfl.jpg (http://s83.photobucket.com/user/ajcoholic/media/IMG_0802_zpsnzjs3pfl.jpg.html)

Put that Shopbot to work! ;)

[jTr]

Why the switch from the Lamello to dowels? Faster/cheaper? Would you hybrid the two to reduce lamello connector quantity yet retain the ability to ship flat for on-site assembly?

jeff

[Bob Eustace]

Nice work Andrew!

[Ajcoholic]

Why the switch from the Lamello to dowels? Faster/cheaper? Would you hybrid the two to reduce lamello connector quantity yet retain the ability to ship flat for on-site assembly?

jeff

Well, i think slotting everything for biscuits is still too slow to use for assembly for large jobs. To put together something like a kitchen or a bunch of drawer boxes, I would like to get away from the biscuits. Not to be confused with the Clamex connectors (I did not use them on the drawer, I used just regular #20 biscuits glued in). Using dowels with the Lamello Clamex would be great also for cases, if you wanted to assemble on site. But I'm thinking more just for putting cases together in the shop without need for screws, nails or staples etc.

Ive only just started to fool with the boring machine but I think its going to be very slick.

[Ajcoholic]

Nice work Andrew!


Thanks Bob.. its fun to try new things. :)

[bleeth]

Andrew: Once you go to dowel assembly you're not far from adding case clamp and a serious dowel drill/inserter.

[ckurak]

Andrew,

What portable bander? What brand? What model? Hand-banding the curves is overly time-consuming, and often lacks in quality. I am looking for a better method for some of my curved work.

[jTr]

I would like to get away from the biscuits.

I ditched biscuits a few years ago- you must try a festool domino if you're wanting for a better loose tenon solution. The precision of the machine and accuracy of alignment is top notch.

Further, for applications discussed in this thread, you can easily plot domino mortise patterns for the cnc to cut on vertical panels. Simply cut mortises with the Festool in ends of horizontal case pieces and you have a very efficient strong joint.

I imagine you'll employ a similar process with your new machine with dowels. Still, the domino can unlock a lot of potential for fast solid construction in a much larger variety of situations, FWIW.

Thanks for sharing- helps us all rethink ways to optimize our processes.

Jeff

[jTr]

What portable bander? What brand? What model? Hand-banding the curves is overly time-consuming, and often lacks in quality. I am looking for a better method for some of my curved work.

Charles,
Andrew mentioned in another thread his is a Cantek, AKA LeMatic. Don't mean to speak for Andrew, but I've been pouring over same issues you mentioned and thought I'd share options discovered:
1- Cheapest is a Virutex AG98F that I've used for years - just under $400. Downside is it's a hot-air system using pre-glued .040 mil stuff- not the strongest, but does a nice job reasonably quickly. Beats the heck out of an iron, especially on those curves.
2- Virutex, LeMatic and several China knock offs available are all based on the same essential core machine assembly with a glue pot, which offers a definite step up in bond strength. $2800 - $3200 for a name brand with warranty, as little as $850 direct from China on ebay, no warranty implied or expressed.
3- Here comes Festool again - new Conturo machine introduced in the US a few months ago. On par for Festool, lots of costly proprietary accessories to really get it working with you, including the glue pucks. Most significant difference is the puck system they claim is easier to clean, and you can choose from 4 different glue colors (though I've never found anything other than the natural was needed).

Let us know what you go with, Chuck.

Back to you, Andrew!

Jeff

[Ajcoholic]

Andrew: Once you go to dowel assembly you're not far from adding case clamp and a serious dowel drill/inserter.

lol Dave, Id been looking for a used case clamp. But for the time being my rack of Bessey K body clamps will do the trick. I am not after all, a production shop.

I do have dowel gluing attachments for my 5 litre Lamello LK5 pressure gluing pot. It makes applying the glue in an 8mm hole fast and accurate.

[Ajcoholic]

Andrew,

What portable bander? What brand? What model? Hand-banding the curves is overly time-consuming, and often lacks in quality. I am looking for a better method for some of my curved work.

Yup, the Cantek variable speed model, which is made by Comatic/Lematic. I was also looking at the Virutex, but have a good working relationship with Akhurst Machinery here in Canada (that own the Cantek label). I bought a demo used at a trade show for a few days, for a considerable discount. $2200 VS close to $3K Canadian for brand new.

I will say there is a pretty big learning curve with these machines. I spent a better part of a whole day and a few hundred feet of 1mm tape, until I got the hang of it reliably. You need to apply the pressure, and at the same time make sure you keep up with the feed roller, and not let the tape bunch up. But once you do get it, it works very well. Frustrated - I was for the first few hours. But like anything in life, keep at it and you will eventually get the hang of it.

I was also lookign at the Festool bander. But at close to $6K for the package, it was too much.

I refused to edge band with preglued tape and an iron - so a few years ago I decided eventually I'd invest on one of these. Finally did. Most of my decisions I plan a long time ahead.

[Ajcoholic]

Charles,
Andrew mentioned in another thread his is a Cantek, AKA LeMatic. Don't mean to speak for Andrew, but I've been pouring over same issues you mentioned and thought I'd share options discovered:
1- Cheapest is a Virutex AG98F that I've used for years - just under $400. Downside is it's a hot-air system using pre-glued .040 mil stuff- not the strongest, but does a nice job reasonably quickly. Beats the heck out of an iron, especially on those curves.
2- Virutex, LeMatic and several China knock offs available are all based on the same essential core machine assembly with a glue pot, which offers a definite step up in bond strength. $2800 - $3200 for a name brand with warranty, as little as $850 direct from China on ebay, no warranty implied or expressed.
3- Here comes Festool again - new Conturo machine introduced in the US a few months ago. On par for Festool, lots of costly proprietary accessories to really get it working with you, including the glue pucks. Most significant difference is the puck system they claim is easier to clean, and you can choose from 4 different glue colors (though I've never found anything other than the natural was needed).

Let us know what you go with, Chuck.

Back to you, Andrew!

Jeff

Jeff, you said it :) The Festool system does look very slick. And I love my other Festool tools. But it is 2X the cost. I think the Cantek unit will serve me well. Especially with some more practice and getting the glue and feed speeds dialed in.

[Ajcoholic]

I ditched biscuits a few years ago- you must try a festool domino if you're wanting for a better loose tenon solution. The precision of the machine and accuracy of alignment is top notch.

Further, for applications discussed in this thread, you can easily plot domino mortise patterns for the cnc to cut on vertical panels. Simply cut mortises with the Festool in ends of horizontal case pieces and you have a very efficient strong joint.

I imagine you'll employ a similar process with your new machine with dowels. Still, the domino can unlock a lot of potential for fast solid construction in a much larger variety of situations, FWIW.

Thanks for sharing- helps us all rethink ways to optimize our processes.

Jeff

Hey Jeff
I do have a domino for several years. It does get used lots too. But I still use a lot of biscuits. Each has a place. Biscuits are much less money and dominos are overkill for many things where a biscuit will do.

If you think the domino machine be is precise... You should pick up and look at a genuine lamello machine. I currently use the top 20 (super erred by the top 21) and of course the zeta p2. These are far better built imo than the festool domino. The lamello machines are like a fine Swiss watch.

Each tool gets used a whole lot and has its strength

[Burkhardt]

For small volume production you may want to try my box clamp. They apply even pressure and keep everything perpendicular. I posted that a while ago somewhere here with Vcarve files (http://www.tailmaker.net/clamping-jig.html) and you can cut it yourself on the Bot (you may have to blow up the dimensions for drawers, though and make some brackets longer for wide front boards).

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-uln_J7ICZ1k/VGktSB7JIeI/AAAAAAAAFdM/SYWes1_THME/w1201-h853-no/DSC02886.JPG