Second CNC?

[Austin Shafer]

Hello everyone,

My employer has recently asked me to start shopping around for a bigger CNC so I can run both to double production. We currently have a 2009 standard 48" buddy with a spindle and 10' powerstick. We use the machine for cutting playground equipment out of HDPE playboard so it will not need be used for 3D work. They want to find a used "like new" machine with Vacuum hold down hopefully but if there was a cheap enough new one I am sure it could happen. My problem is that they want me to not limit it to just shopbot, but I have no clue what other companies are good. I love shopbot and have used them for years and their customer service is amazing and I don't know how long it would take for me to get used to a new different brand machine. What do you guys have for me about other CNC companies? they are also wanting a automatic tool changer if possible.

[Austin Shafer]

What do you guys think of baileigh CNC's? they seem promising but I am not sure.

[Davo]

Why would they want to switch from Shopbot?

[Austin Shafer]

they don't "want" to switch they just don't want me limiting my search to just shopbots.

[Brian Harnett]

Whatever you get if its a different machine than shopbot the interface will be another system to learn, separate operating files will be needed, when I worked in a production shop we tried to keep similar equipment to cut down on training and mistakes.

[Austin Shafer]

Yes! I am thinking shopbot but was just going to see what was out there.

[bleeth]

To quote Donald Sutherland: "Never heard of it."

[Austin Shafer]

So what kind of sites would I browse to find used shopbots. Other than here of course.

[coryatjohn]

There is something to be said for standardization. Airlines that fly multiple types of airplanes have much higher maintenance and support budgets. They have to a much more complex training department. Companies that have different manufacturers of delivery vehicles are in the same boat. If your company has multiple vendors for a major piece of equipment like a CNC, it will mean increased training, maintenance and operational expenses. While it's laudable to look, even if there was a marginally better machine, having two different machines would be less profitable regardless of what improvement was offered by a second machine. The only rational reason why you would look for a different manufacturer is if your company was planning on switching out ALL machines to one vendor. Otherwise, it's rather a fool's errand to do what you're being asked.

I'm guessing the person asking has no idea what difficulties and complexities are involved with using a CNC machine. You've got a tough task in front of you and it's more political than technical. If your current machine is operating satisfactorily, what possible value could be added by getting another different machine? It could only be a worse experience and a more costly one too.

As for alternatives, there are plenty. I strongly considered a Laguna but decided that their support just didn't cut it.

[gbradley]

Stick with an American made machine. Don't go to the cnc manufacturing dark side. I have modified a Chinese machine vacuum system, and learn from my experience you will have more headaches than you need.

26995

This is one of the PVC T's that was on the machine. Most of the inside of the pipe is blocked by glue.

I won't get into what I had to do to the grid on the machine!

[gundog]

You can't answer a question like this without knowing the budget? You can buy multi spindle tool changing machines with material loaders if cost is no object. A tool changer adds considerable cost control system makes a big difference. You can buy a used industrial router on the cheap $15-$30K with old control systems that have seen a lot of work but who will program it and keep it running? Shopbot and Vetric make programming a breeze not so much with older control systems. A big industrial router will also weigh 10000 pounds + and need a lot of power many have 20Hp or larger spindles.

Mike

[tri4sale]

What do you guys have for me about other CNC companies? they are also wanting a automatic tool changer if possible.

When I did my search for my first CNC, ShopBot, Camaster and Laguna Tools were the ones that came up often. Posting under the hardware section of Vectric tools will probable get you a better response for different companies. I think Camaster has their own forum too. Everyone here is probably a little biased when it comes to brand :)

Be sure to highlight to the bosses the disadvantages of running multiple brands of CNC machines. 2x the training costs for different control software, and it could be real easy to issue a command for CNC 1 that you meant to do on CNC 2 and now you've damaged material, or even the machine itself.

As for used equipment, here, eBay and the other forums are your best bet. One good judge of quality of machine to me is how often used ones come on the market. If you see lots of a brand listed used for sale, really should look into why so many used ones available. Are owners not happy with them? Are they upgrading often?

[myxpykalix]

One thing i can tell you is that EVERY file (toolpath) will have to be REMADE using the different post processor. If you only have 5 files, no big deal. If you have 500...BIG DEAL.
Think about where you are located in reference to Shopbot for parts, shipping, tech support. At this point the pro's outnumber the con's.

[RossMosh]

1. Your boss and you need to do is sit down and figure out a budget and a list of things you're looking for. Then you want to approach vendors with a good reputation and discuss their products and get a demo.

2. Try to find a site with a wider variety of users. This is a forum for ShopBot users and asking anyone to recommend their direct competition is in poor taste.

3. Your boss and you need to evaluate how much production efficiency will improve with 2 machines vs 1 better machine. There is no straight forward answer to this question. You'll have to evaluate it yourself but one thing to really think about is what are you doing while your current machine works? Also look at the time spent changing out sheets and/or going to the next job.

4. Maybe because I find most software easy to learn, but I wouldn't give a second thought to running two different types of machines. I'd generate my toolpaths from 1 software (VCarve Pro likely in this situation) and then the only thing you'd have to think about is your control software, which depending on what you're doing, you shouldn't have to mess with too often.

[James M]

Hey I would sign up for the Vectric forum as there is lots of different CNC machines running VCP.

Cheers,

James

[Xray]

Try cnczone or sawmillcreek, bad form to ask about other machines - And I own a other machine.