Jumps between toolpaths

[unicraft]

Hi, Is there a way to create a cutting file asking the ShopBot to jump (or jag?) from a toolpath to the next toolpath without going back to the zero point?

Thanks

Hugo

[ron brown]

Vauge Question- But yes. In fact, I have created toolpaths where I went through a good part because I forgot to put lines in to pickup the Z axis - OOPs.

Ron

[kerrazy]

Yes just go into the file with a text program like Notepad and remove those lines so it does not keep going back.
Dale

[gerald_d]

Dale, you make it sound so simple, but if it is so simple, why can't PW have a button to delete all those surplus home jogs automatically?

These surplus home jogs are a common complaint, and the popular advice is to use Notepad to edit the file. This is unacceptable - the product should be be smarter than that. Sorry guys, but as much as you love and defend PartsWizard, you should insist on something that works first time and does not routinely require a NotePad edit.

[kerrazy]

Gerald,
I echo your comments, But I do believe there is a solution, I just have to remeber it as I have not used Parts Wizard since last spring.

Bear with me though and I will see if I can recall it.
Dale

[don_ask]

I agree with Gerald. I use PW most of the time, however it is missing a few things even a basic program should have.

Going back to home is time consuming and should be fixed.

I can not easily print a copy of a design. There is no print build into the program. When I design a sign for a customer I want to print a copy for approval before I cut. Doing a screen print or using a utiliy screen capture program should not be required.

An export to vector should be part of the program also.

I realize that PW is the bottom line of many fine programs available. BUT, we should not need to upgrade to print.

[stickman]

Reflecting back to this post.

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=1038&post=13416#POST13416

[MARK HOLM (Unregistered Guest)]

May I add my opinion, for what it's worth; If you want to get the most from your SB you must be able to manipulate code, particularly the simple edits noted above. You cannot rely exclusively upon PW to deliver parts files with no edits required. You can greatly increase tool path efficiency if you have the ability to make basic file edits (Notepad works well). The set-up manual that comes with the SB is a reasonable guide to understanding and manipulating raw code. This guide contains a wealth of valuable knowledge to the SBer. You owe it to yourself to read and understand these documents.

[gerald_d]

Correct if I am wrong, but the SB-folk are silent on the shortcomings of PW highlighted here in the Forum? The thing is that we know PW is a very young piece of software and therefore we hold back on the criticism thinking that the "groans" are being monitored and that new releases will have fixes soon. But, for this major groan (surplus home jogs), the SB-folk have been fairly silent for quite a while, suggesting that no fix is planned? So we are sort of in the dark - does one bother to finish the learning curve on PW, or does one bail out now and purchase more mature CAM software?

[kerrazy]

I know I will get a blast for this from several of you...But here goes, I'll hang on during the reprecussions.
Partswizard that ships for free with the tool allows you to get your feet wet. Most tools available today offer software upgrades, as does ShopBot. Why, because not all of us do similar things with our tools, I would suggest we consider Parts Wizard as a learning ground to build the fundamentals before we step into the moderate to heavy priced software available.
Remember, Your control software which is also free will allow you to do many of the things Parts Wizard does, and with the new windows version of Control software it will allow you to do more. ShopBot has given out Parts WIzard as it is a Windows freindly version, to help reduce the learning curve, and get new users up and running quicker.
To consider it a staple is a big wall you'll find you will hit more often than not.

I used Parts wizard for the first 4 months and then I got a taste of other software out there that ShopBot has available and I have not looked back. That is not to say Parts Wizard is not suitable for a new user, but as you grow with your tool so should your software environment.

Have a look around and no you don't all need a $7500.00 version of ArtCam Pro. for some Partswizard will do everything you'll ever need it to do.
Let's not look a gift horse in the mouth.
Dale

[Brady Watson]

PartWizard is a lot of program for $495. It is the perfect program to be shipped out with a new ShopBot tool. If SB still shipped Vector I would bet that more of our tools would be up for sale IMHO. What other design AND toolpathing program is capable of running a router AND plasma right out of the box (within 10 minutes) without searching message boards and asking for help? None that I am aware of. It's pretty good for what it costs and what it does.

As far as it jogging home after each toolpath...big deal. It takes me 2 seconds to wipe out the J3 command if I can't deal with it, and save it. There are little nuisances with every toolpathing program. I think that PW is a pretty good deal considering it is included in the price of the tool.

-Brady

[stickman]

To the Group,

Dale and Brady, Gerald and Don. I can agree with points that you all make.

Brady, I enjoyed the fact that I could take PW out of the box and do with it what I have done in the last four months. There are great points about the software. And yes, its quite a program for what they ask for it.

Gerald, I agree with you in your points that it probably should be doing a little more.

Dale, It is a stepping stone for other programs.

But, do you want to know something crazy. At my day job, we got in a piece of software for our point to point machine, $1000 dollars. Its only about a 1/10th of what PW will do and runs $125,000 worth of machinery. But its runs and acts like PW. You can print from it though.

The area clear and the machine along vectors buttons of PW are not part of the other software. The V-Carve is priceless, though it could have just a couple more fonts.

With a few added options and features to Part Wizard, I think that ShopBot can add greatly to the potential that the machine can offer to its owners. I do think printing would be a good feature. Even if its just a simple line drawing. It would be handy to have in the shop when cutting the file. Saving to a dxf would allow me to move back and forth from design software back to part wizard.

These are just my thoughts, but after working with it for a few months, just some features I'd like to see added.

Thanks,

Jay Mack

StickMan WoodWorking

[gerald_d]

It is a well-known practise to bundle some "freeware" with computer-driven hardware purchases. And it is also universally accepted that this "freeware" is just the very basics to get you started and is a teaser to upgrade to the full-blown package.

Previously, ShopBots were shipped with Vector that was not a reduced teaser package and thus it was a vicious learning curve that very few of us ever completed. ShopBot had to do something about the "unfriendly" bundled software that was undoubtedly damaging their reputation.

Along came PartWizard and our first logical impression was that it was supposed to be a replacement for Vector, but with a much friendlier learning curve. Being a brand-new program, we had the impression that PartWizard would be de-bugged to get it up to the level of performance that Vector had. Now, about 2 years later(?), I am starting to form the impression that it is "beginner's teaser" software.

I am convinced that removing the surplus jogs, adding a print facility & adding a dxf export facility can very easily be done by DelCam, but their thinking is that fewer people will move up to the higher level DelCam products. I am not a smart marketing bloke, but I think that PartWizard has been over-restricted, causing people to move away from DelCam altogether.

It would be informative if ShopBot or DelCam told us whether any improvements to PartWizard are planned in the near future. We can then decide whether to invest our time in a Delcam learning curve and budget $3000 for ArtCam Insignia.

[srwtlc]

Does ArtCam Insignia act the same as Parts Wizard (i.e. jog homes, no printing, no saving as .dxf, etc.)? I've been considering Insignia 3 and I'd like to hear from some of you that are using it. What are your thoughts? Good, bad, other?

No Gerald, my kindred spirit (http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=30&post=8129#POST8129), I'm not giving up my Vector ;-) I just would like some of the other features Insignia has.

[gordon]

First of all, thanks to all of you for your comments and help with Part Wizard issues on the forum. The way ShopBotters share valuable experience and knowledge on the forum is one of the things that makes ShopBot great.

Part Wizard is 2 years old now and, with one update, has been a great entry level CAM program for generating ShopBot Part files. It was never seen as a total CAD/CAM package but was originally meant to be a replacement for VectorCAM - one that would be easier to use and still produce good toolpaths. Vector wasn't a bad CAM program, but it was diffcult to use and hence costly to support.

Now a key part of the ShopBot system, Part Wizard was the first venture of an OEM CAD/CAM application for both DelCAM and ShopBot and we all had a considerable learning curve. In developing the next version with DelCAM, we have made use of several years of user feedback, requests and our own experiences to bring it up to the next level. After 2 years of experience with the current version and many months of development Part Wizard v2 is very near its release date. DelCAM has agreed to add a lot of tools to Part Wizard that are missing in the current version. The new version will have the same friendly look and feel with the addition of many of the powerful drawing tools and toolpathing algorithms previously found only in Insignia and ArtCAM Pro. Part Wizard 2 will include all of the Vector Editing tools in Insignia 2 such as the welding and alignment tools with the exception of Text Along a Curve being simplified from the Insignia version. V-carving and the other toolpathing will be the same as it is now with the addition of the newer, faster algorithm from ArtCAM Pro 7. The Import Filters have been improved and will now accept DXF files form the latest versions of AutoCAD.

DelCAM has been very interested in improving Part Wizard and appreciates the success for the users, ShopBot and DelCAM. DelCAM must, however, maintain a distinction between Part Wizard and its core applications of Insignia and Pro. Our partnership has been great and has increased the value of the ShopBot system by offering a toolpath generator that doesn't cost as much as the machine, yet has much of the capability of higher priced CAM applications that are harder to use.

Most of the issues that you've pointed out have been addressed and taken care of in the up and coming version. The good news is that Surplus Jogs will now be eliminated from the postings and you'll be able to print the 2D screen. The start points will now be accepted as the starting point of the toolpath. The bad news is that you still won't be able to export the model or toolpath in a DXF or DWG file. There were various other little issues that have been improved and/or corrected in the v2 taking Part Wizard and ShopBot a major step forward.

Here's the "teaser": You won't be able to get the new version of Part Wizard for another month and it will not be a free upgrade. You'll have to pay an upgrade fee --- unless you want to buy a new tool!

Please feel free to call me or email if you have any other questions or concerns that have not been addressed here. We appreciate your feedback and do the best we can to make ShopBots work the way you need them to.

Gordon Bergfors
ShopBot Tools, Inc.

[gerald_d]

Thanks Gordon! That was very informative and positive. You may yet convert me to a Part Wizard user - mainly to keep up with the new voices at the Forum
.

[unicraft]

Hey!
Thank you guys for all your help. I didn't reply before, every day I found new clues from you. I'm working in the creation of my files and "simulating" cuttings.
Well, our machine will arrive tomorrow, I'll be happy to contact the forum the learn more and more.

[ckurak]

Gordon,

This may sound like a trivial issue to some, but it forces me to manually edit each and every SBP file that I create.

Will v2 solve the problem with the "VD" command being commented out? (Please look at: http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=1038&post=12241#POST12241 from January 2004.)

I need to work both in inches and mm's. With different jobs requiring different measuring systems, I am constantly switching back and forth. For safety's sake, I now need to manually edit every SBP file to remove the ' before the "VD" command. If I didn't, and I forgot to manually change systems before the next file cut, there could/would be a cutting disaster.

There already is a method in PartWizard to save in either format, please check with DelCam to be sure that it is completely operational in v2.

Thanks!!!

[load]

hi ya all, just wanted to share a little info and a trick i got as far as the PW gose :P

well i did just get it and i can say it is by far better then what i had for a cam program which was signlab5, the 2 things that i find i do not like about it is you cant export to dxf file. the other thing is how it jogs home after each toolpath,,, however a trick that i found to make it easyer to edit the sbp file and get rid of them nasty jogs is the windows version of the SB control comes with a part file editor that works and looks like a text editor how ever you can can click on the binoculare or do a serch for the next line that says J3 and click next until you see one that runs it to home delete that one line and serch on for the next and you will emliminate the jog homes ;)

Paul