Anybody using their ShopBot like a vinyl cutter?

[kfitzgerald@graphicmetalsinc.com]

We are experimenting with using our ShopBot for cutting painting masks. Is there an adapter out there that will allow us to chuck our vinyl cutting point in the PC router?

Regards,

Kevin Fitz-Gerald
Project Manager

Graphic Metals, Inc.
P.O. Box 31
Bryan, OH 43506
Voice 419-636-5757
Fax 419-636-6404

kfitzgerald@graphicmetalsinc.com (mailto:kfitzgerald@graphicmetalsinc.com)

[davidnix@pld.com]

Check here for a vinyl cutter for ShopBot for $300:

Vinyl Mate

[davidnix@pld.com]

Vinyl mate http://www.telusplanet.net/public/gberscht/

[papadaveinwy]

Kevin, for very large sheets say over 36" wide then it becomes a plus for the bot to do vinyl or paint masks, but if you are going to do very many then I would spring for a plotter vinyl cutter.I know I'm going to get some feed back from this as I have in the past; but if you are doing much vinyl or masks or sand masks the bot can not keep up, it takes to long to set up the vinyl. 1. spray on some spray glue: ease of release type. 2. make sure it is very smooth. 3 clean up the residue 4. get a new piece of very expensive spray mask after the one didn't cut right. 5 don't even think of really expensive reflective vinyl with the Bott. If you buy a 24" plotter then you can overlap the material to make wider ones say 46" or 69" or more in width,you can get it with a feed roller for the rolls of the vinyl and if you buy one with pressure tracking instead of the punched tracking type then you can use up all or almost all the otherwise wasted scrap. all this for around 3,000.00 and you get some nice software that you can also use with the bot for designing. just design a sign and save as dxf My 2 cents [
] David in Wyoming

[bjwat@comcast.net]

I agree David. The Vinyl Mate is a nice little tool...but if you're a professional, use the right tool for the job.

I can pound in nails with cresent wrench or a hammer. Which one is going to cause you less headaches, produce a superior product and consistently do it's job over and over again?

The Vinyl Mate looks like a nice piece for someone who does occasional vinyl work.

-Brady

[graphicmetals]

We already have a vinyl plotter. What we are trying to do is paint on the routed surfaces; i.e. paint gold down inside v-carved lettering, paint cleared areas with a highlight color, etc. We have found that if we mask first over the wood, then v-carve through the mask, we can paint it easily. You cannot do this by cutting the mask on a vinyl plotter and trying to place it onto the surface to be painted. The problem is that for some cutting operations, the router bit leaves a fuzzy edge on the wood and/or tears/pulls the mask away from the wood. This creates a problem with paint migrating under the damaged areas. We were thinking that if we simply cut the mask with a plotter knife chucked in the router (router turned off of course), it would eliminate most of these problems.

[papadaveinwy]

The problem with that is you have to make sure that your file for cuting the mask with the vinyl mate or whatever is done so the portion of the mask that you weed out is going to be the right width, ie: the same width as the top of your v cut. Otherwise you will have areas that do not get painted or areas that get to much paint at the surface. try some calenderd vinyl 3mil or 3.5 mil placed on your wood first then rout then remove the vinyl after you paint make sure you use a sharp bit. Just a thought. David in Wyoming

[ssmith@skeeball.com]

I’m not a sign maker but this is what I did:
Put a coat of polyurethane on the blank wood, V-cut my sign, sprayed the letter color, sanded off the over spray, topcoat with poly. The poly on the blank kept the spray paint from penetrating the wood making it easy to sand off. It also worked as a seal coat for my topcoat.

[papadaveinwy]

scott that is exactly the way I do it in my shop, except whet all the sign gets painted,after routing 1.I first prime with oil base primer,2.then I paint the main color3. then the letters etc. but for nateral wood for the main part I use sanding sealer,rout, Then paint letters etc. just as you said. David in Wyoming

[bjwat@comcast.net]

If my memory serves me correctly, Chip Marshall was telling me about 'Sign Mask', a product designed for exactly what you are talking about doing. It goes on the material, you cut through it, paint and then peel off.

You could paint your highlight color first, then mask it, then cut and paint in the groove. I haven't used it, but have seen the results and they are clean and sharp.

I don't recall the name of the supplier, but they are located in Philadelphia, PA. You also might be able to use sandblasting mask since it is resistant to edge erosion unlike vinyl.

I found a link on the subject here:

http://www.signweb.com/dimensional/cont/blast_materials.htm

Hope that helps,
Brady

[rookie432]

I've used some of the "cut through" paint mask product. as a matter of fact I am working on my second roll. The only problem I have is that it must be a vinyl based product. If your cutter isn't highly sharp then it tends to want to curl at the cut point a bit. The other problem is that with extended cutting times your endmill will heat up. This will heat the paint mask enough to really want to curl just where you don't want it to. Blast mat is too soft to get a crisp edge with an endmill I think. I usually hand roll or brush my base color, apply mask, machine, spray secondary color, peel mask , then go back and touch up any over spray that might have found its way underneath the mask at the cut point. This may be a little redundant but it beats handpainting the whole thing after the cut. I have found that the mask will hold much better if there is only 1 pass through the material.
Two cents from Bill

[jimavey]

My 2 cents: I have a vinyl mate cutter and the performance is amazing. The Setup times are fast. I spend just as much time setting up a piece of plywood for a cut. I bet the people that posted the "buy a plotter" messages don't have and haven't tried a vinyl mate. This tool really expands the versatility of the ShopBot.

I've made signs 18"x24" with no problem. And even some little 1.5" x3" "Badges". This is one tool that shows off just how precise the ShopBot can cut.

[papadaveinwy]

James, Try doing a sign in vinyl with 14" tall letters that runs 12' long and then go and watch someone with a plotter cut the same sign I have used a tool just like the vinylmate: and I have a 24" and a 60" plotter printer cutter and believe me the bot canot keep up. I can set my cut run at 153cm\sec.(If my math is close thats about 62.5" per sec) if I so choose. Compare that to a bots speed. plus I don't have to take time to attach the vinyl to a piece of wood or whatever.I simply put on a roll 150' long on to two roller caps. place that onto my machine, pull it through the pressure rollers hit the send key and it is done.It takes me about 30 secs. to set up or change colors. Now beat that with the vinylmate and the bot. don't get me wrong for guys that just do vinyl once in a while the vinyl mate is ok, but if you want to make MONEY doing vinyl then get a plotter.I do about 65% of my business with vinyl.and I love my Bot. I have had it going on 4 years If I remember right. David in Wyoming

[csbrads@comcast.net]

I have both a vinyl plotter and the vinyl mate for the shopbot. ( I had the vinyl mate first)

The vinyl mate does perform exactly as it says.
The reason I bought the vinyl plotter was for speed only. I still cut the anchor sand blast material on the shopbot using the vinyl mate.

Carroll

[papadaveinwy]

Carrol Great use for the vinyl mate. this type of an application is were it will shine, put on the blast mask, cut out with bot, sand blast etc. remove mask . perfect choice but as you and I said for speed for vinyl signs use the plotter.David in Wyoming.

[jimavey]

The original question question posted was " Is there an adapter out there that will allow us to chuck our vinyl cutting point in the PC router?
The answer is "YES" Use a Vinyl Mate.


Speed was never the point of the original post. Making vinyl signs for money full time was not the point of the original post.

So why introduce these factors and then discount the value of the Vinyl Mate?

David Snow is saying "spend ten times the money and you'll go faster" That's true! And true for CNC routers, cars and women too.

Bottom line: The Vinyl Mate expands the list of materials you can cut with a ShopBot. It works great.

[papadaveinwy]

James David Snow here,
If you LOOK at my posts on this you will see that I said that the Vinyl Mate is a good tool for someone that is doing a small amount of vinyl or in another post I said that a really good use for it is to place on spray mask use it to cut out patern then spray or sand blast. It is a very good tool. Just not if you want to do alot of vinyl signage. That is when a person should look at a plotter. Plus the fact that you get some really good software worth about $2500.00 if you were to buy that by itself; and you can use the same software with the bot to do routed signs, in fact if you look at my new post (new topic)You will see how versatile this software is. David in Wyoming

[jimavey]

I have looked at your posts both present and past and the general message is "buy a plotter". Cause it's faster (plus some more software).

But by saying that you discount the value of the Vinyl mate for someone who has not ever tried a vinyl sign.

You have discouraged people from even experiencing the thrill of making a vinyl sign.

The limits aren't the Vinyl Mate - it is the basic speed of the Shop Bot. But the joy of the Shop Bot is that for a fraction of the cost of other cnc routers you can "get in the game". I know I wouldn't have a cnc router if I had to spend 10x the amount (or even 5x the amount of a ShopBot).

And you really don't sacrifice much of anything in quality or speed once you start making parts.

The vinyl mate can do all your plotter can do, at a fraction of the cost and takes a little more time. hmmm just like the justification for the ShopBot itself.

On the first go round of posts a few months ago I held back, but this time I decided to point out just how unfair and narrow your take on this product is.

[papadaveinwy]

James once again you are not LOOKING at my posts. Let me put it so you can understand. THE VINYL MATE IS A GREAT TOOL,FOR SOMEONE THAT DOES A SMALL AMOUNT OF VINYL!!!!!!!! OK. David in Wyoming

[kerrazy]

I just found after a year of searching the perfect mask!!!!
Gerbar mask 2 works great on acrylic painted surfaces, it does not lift at all when being cut!!! Yeah!
You can literally paint with a mop this stuff stays nice and clean.
There are two types Mask one or low tack and Mask Two, a high tack that leaves little to no residue. any residue can be removed with a small amount of varsol.
I have tried avery and other brands and nothing so far has compared.
Just paint you blank like you are going to finish it and then let it dry over night and apply the mask. Squeegie out any air bubbles and go cut it. I have left it on the surface for up to 5 days and it comes off clean with like I said little if any adhesive residue.
You can buy it in Canada from ND graphics. it is a little pricey $210.00 CAD for a 150yd roll. But in my opinion worth it.
Dale