Extera issues, I think...

[thecustomsignshop]

Used Xtera many times, and while I personally do not like the product, I had a piece in the shop so I decided to use it. Primed and painted it as I have done with many other signs. Never had an issue.

Got a call from the customer after about 2 weeks. He noticed a bubble. It is about a odd shaped quarter. Sure enough it is an issue. The rest of the sign is fine. Odd.

Here is the question. Those of you who have had issues with Extera, what did your issue look like? Is it a bubble or does the paint just fall off?

Thanks. Any photos would help...

[joe]

Jim,

Sorry to hear about your problem. It might be worth your time to search the forum on the subject. I've posted several times with solutions. Yes the problem has been pealing of paint.

This product is used in my shop all the time. It's been a couple of years since we've had a problem.

How did you prime and paint the sign?

[thecustomsignshop]

Hey Joe. I did search the forum and unless I missed something, I did not find a photo that matched my issue.

I used a primer sealer that I used many times before. The paint was a BenMoore color the customer requested, an acrylic latex. I must have about 40 Extera signs out there, never an issue. Sprayed.

I'm thinking that maybe this was a one off issue.

Being the fact it was in the negitive numbers when I installed it, maybe the paint failed. Not sure yet if the primer bubbled also or just the paint.

[joe]

Jim,

Ok, lets take it from the top.

Several years ago, when Extira made it's way on the market, we started using it but there were intermitent failures. The most offen was when applying vinyl letters. When the transfer mask was being removed, sometimes off came the paint.

There was lots of flap on wwww.letterville.com (http://www.letterville.com) about it. Like you, some of us got by for a while but every now and again it would fail.

There were suspecions the amount impregnated Phenolic Resins were heavier on some batches. Anyway I found by rolling on a diluted solution of epoxy solved the problem. This was just another step I din't want to take. Fortunately one of the SB contributors sent in a simple solution that really works. Give the panel a quick wash off with soap and water to get rid of the oils. That really works.

Now we take a good scrub brush, soap and water and hose it down. This gives a beautiful soft surface for the primer to stick to. We move about a dozen sheets a week through the shop and this has solved the problem.

Note: Extira is very water resistant. Water based primers don't stick as well as oil based primers. Oil and water don't mix very well.

Good luck,

Joe

[thecustomsignshop]

Thanks for the info Joe. It was a solvent based primer. While I'm thinking I will try to avoid using Extira again, the wash down is a good idea.

What I'm looking for is a photo of the failure in the early stages if possible and some feedback.

I'm trying to make a decision, do I recut the sign in sign foam or make the needed repairs on the completed sign in hopes it will hold. If I make the repairs, for example, what method of repair will work?

I normally use body filler to smooth out a damaged area before priming and painting. Will this work?

It is a 36x36 sign double sided and only one small area on one side has failed.

All in all, I will focus on using HDU or Trupan in the future....

I'm hoping to compare my issues with some others. Has anyone repaired a problem like this and if so, how?

[nailzscott]

Joe, I have someone looking for an external sign - on a budget, but have been leary of using extira because of all I've read. In summary, if you were to do a simple carved sign, you would:
1. Wash it
2. Roll on a diluted epoxy - any brand recommendations.
3. Apply oil based primer

Can you then mask before carving - then just prime and paint the carved portions?

All I may have to do for the customer is do the cutting, but, if they do the painting themselves, I don't want to set them up for failure.

Thanks

[pete]

Jim

I know this may be a wishy-washy suggestion, but can you add a 3-D element to cover the defect (on both sides to make it match) - a logo, or some other element?

I only make this suggestion because the problem seems to be a one-off problem and probably a localized defect - not a widespread issue as evidenced with the rest of this sign and your other signs being OK.

Pete

[billp]

Jim,
Try hitting that spot with a few coats of shellac. My experience with Extira was that shellac was the only reliable primer because the alcohol base cuts through the "water barrier chemical" they apparently apply on a less than thorough basis...

[joe]

Bill,

It's hard to tell whats going on with this particular panel. Your suggestion may work but I'm concerned the primer hasn't done it's job. Perhaps a photo would help.

One optomistic solution is to wet sand down the spot, seal off with kills and roll or spray another coat.

I'm not a big fan of using Extira for large panels. Paint adhesion isn't a concern, but it's way too heavy, requires braces to prevent warping and is soft on the edges.

I still prefer HDO and MDO for panel work, however when placed under the router, I like Extira. In some case I like it better than HDU which doesn't like screws.

One way to text paint adhesion is with the 2" masking tape test. Once burnished down, give it a yark. Then you'll know.

[joe]

Hey, that's a good idea. Give a YARK! I'm gonna try that.

[thecustomsignshop]

Hey All. Thanks for the input.

Bill, I will try that thanks, body filler should stick to shellac, correct?... Chat with you soon.

Peter, good idea but the customer is set on the design. Good idea though..

I'm going to pick up the sign and I'll post some photos this week.

[thecustomsignshop]

Good News. We got the sign back and when I cut into the blister, the primer was fine, but the paint had an oil film to it where it would bond to the primer.

Turns out we must have spilled oil near the sign and never caught it. Its true, oil and water do not mix. LOL Easy fix, bad mistake...

[drodda]

Joe,

Put down the mouse and step back from the Keyboard!!!

So if I am following you correctly, to "TEXT" paint adhesion, just give it a "YARK"?

Typing skills is the second thing to go I hear?

-D