What do you think of my logo?

[knight_toolworks]

I wanted to keep it simple and make it something easy to vcarve. so why not make vcarved letters?
here is a better one http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1939753/logo.jpg

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[shoeshine]

Steve, please take this as constructive criticism I love the idea, but I see a few potential pitfalls in your design.

It kind of depends how you plan to use this.

1) the fine lines get busy. It is fine for a largish sign but printed on a business card it becomes quite hard to read. For impact in logo design one generally tries to create areas of maximum contrast. Might I suggest a more stylized version for print using beveled letters, and eliminating the fine lines. think in areas of black and white.

2) you need to think about the background over which this will be used. Most corporate logos have a couple of variations for light vs dark backgrounds.

a great way to get a feel for logo design is to go to your local Borders/Barnes & Noble and page through a couple of books on examples of award winning logos. you will quickly see that they have a few things in common.

I have never been in the business of logo design but I spent 8 years as a graphic/web designer for an ad agency and I cant tell you how many times we had to suggest a re-branding (read more $) to get the client supplied designs to work across multiple media. (signs, cards, letterhead, website, etc...)

Unfortunately I'm on vacation and reading this on my netbook that doesn't have any design softs installed or I could shoot you some examples. but if you are still working on this in a week or so I'd be glad to go over a couple of variations with you.

Chris

[myxpykalix]

Steve,
From my perspective i think you have it reversed. To me what you should do is emphasize the name of the company (knight toolworks) and make the service you provide (cnc routing) the smaller of the two.

To save yourself "headroom" in the top of the logo take the router bit off the top and attach it to the downward leg of the N as if it is the shaft of the cutter. Maybe even have a spiral look to that leg or just attach a picture of a spiral bit with a vbit on the end. You can use a little artistic license here. It might help to convey your message better.

[navigator7]

Ditto with Jack.
I like Knight Toolworks.

I think the words "CNC Routing" are a huge turn off.
It's cold. Impersonal.
Noisy.

Not that that is a bad thing!
;-)

[bob_s]

Steve
I agree, put the emphasis on the "Knight Toolworks". You have a very memorable name, and business name, I would use that as your strength. I would also subject whatever you do to what we call the doorway test. After 35 years in commercial arts we came up with the following. Look at it from a distance. For my wife's paintings, it's from the doorway of her studio, for a business card I would think 8 to 10 feet is the right distance. If it is legible and memorable, obviously not the address & phone,at that distance, you are well on your way to an effective business card. Not earth shattering, but an quick and effective way to judge where you design is at.
Bob

[john_l]

In regards to message priority, I think you have it exactly right Steve.

If I am hungry I'm not really that motivated to turn the wheel and pull into the parking lot of a place advertised as "Steve's Spatula". However a sign advertising "PIZZA" might get my attention at the most appropriate time.

"CNC Routing" and the center-lined letters kinda tell's the somewhat uninformed what you sell. "Knight Toolworks" confuses it a little... some might guess, are you selling machines? tools?

I don't follow this advice myself because my business is a little different than the norm. Our trucks have a logo on the doors and a DOT number.. nothing else. I have been working for the same folks over and over since 1983. But unless you are McDonald's, Xerox, or Coca-Cola... you really should emphasize your product, not your name. Just like Steve is doing.

My opinion.

[knight_toolworks]

the knight-toolworks was my plane making business. I only do kits now and so the knight-toolworks does not get a lot of use. My webpage is cncrouting.biz and that's pretty much how people know me now.
I wanted both as I still am somewhat known with the knight-toolworks logo.
but I don't go around passing out cards and such so mostly customers get the cards.
when you do a search for cnc routing in google there I am right at the top.
but this is the best I can do if I want a better logo I would need someone else to make it. I am no artist.

[joe]

The previous advice is very good all round.

I can see you're intending or would like to have a visual Icon. It's possible to have one as an identifier Trade Mark.

The use of your name can be useful when with custom work.

I'm sure you'll come up with something very nice.

[knight_toolworks]

I don't think people well ever see my logo and think of me. the name dos more then anything else. but I need new business cards and right now I don't have anything.

[joe]

Steve,

That's what logo designers are all about.

Joe

[bob_s]

Steve
if you need cards and have a local source that's great. If not there is a web company called Vistaprint that will print them for less than the inkjet supplies will cost you. If you get the coated ones the quality is impressive. I have no connection to this company other than having used them quite a few times. We paid many hundreds of dollars in the past, and now can get better ones for less than 10% of that.
Also consider printing some postcard sized pieces, they can showcase a couple of nice images of your work, and get noticed on a desk or bulletin board.
Using a good source is important. Advertising materials are important, but they can get terribly expensive if you are not careful about picking vendors
Bob

[wberminio]

Steve
I like both designs.I think that they just don't
work so close together.

Try two separate signs or print one on one side of the card and one on the other.

[joe]

Steve,

You might consider the Norm Abrams Workshop sign as an example of how it can work. Yes your logo and name can work together.

[wberminio]

Steve

Try this


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[john_l]

Steve, I'm having trouble with my design computer right now. And the only other we have is a Mac (and I don't touch that one). But maybe include the "Knight Toolworks" as a reversed panel below. It needs a lot more fooling with, but this is the essence.


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[rb99]

Maybe a knight in armor and the jousting shaft could be the router...

[knight_toolworks]

here is a little change for the main part

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[mikeacg]

Steve,

How about doing the lettering with shaded sides to give it depth (like your latest offering)? Try running the design through as standard design file and save the shaded image. Use a white background and gray material fill color

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Mike

[knight_toolworks]

that looks better. though I don't have the software to do it.

[mikeacg]

Steve,
Any ShopBot software will work. You import the file or create type in the file. Then you do a v-carve path (I used a 90 degree v-bit). Set the material to a solid color (at the top of the pull down menu - select White) and select a grey for the fill color. Display path and save shaded image.

[knight_toolworks]

I did not think you were using preview. well duhh that's easy. any opinion on font?

[mikeacg]

A simple font like you started with is probably the best for a design like this. You don't want to complicate it too much since each letter already has multiple faces due to the 3D effect. If you add a little color to the background and tilt the model a bit, you can emphasize the effect even more.

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Mike

[mitch_prest]

kind of related... what have others put on their business cards.. anyone feel like posting their cards for all to see..

mitch

[tappsman]

Steve
I'm certainly not an expert in logo design but I wanted to share some thoughts. In my opinion one of the first things you need to consider is who you are trying to reach. Having machines as versatile as a ShopBot makes this a somewhat difficult task and many of us who are new to the ShopBot world are also struggling with this issue.

If your target market is cabinet, sign, and trophy shops who are familiar with the term "CNC Routing" then you are on the right track. If, on the other hand you are trying to reach the general public, I don't think this logo will be effective. If you ask a man on the street what a router is many, if not most, would think of a computer network router. Even fewer would be familiar with the term "CNC". Engraving, machine carving, and machine cutting may be terms which are more identifiable than CNC Routing.

I would also place a greater emphasis on your company's name. Promoting CNC routing may be great for all of us with CNC routers but your goal is to have the prospect call Steve Knight when they need something cut.

Just my thoughts. Remember, free advice is worth exactly what you pay for it.

[knight_toolworks]

I don't think I will get work because of my logo. almost all of my work is word of mouth. people find me with google using cnc routing. the two big wood stores send people my way and depending they either ask for knight-toolworks or cnc routing.
so I am already known by cncrouting. I am one of the few guys here in Portland now.
so it may be too late to change now.