Curved and Straight Mouldings - Questions

[tvonschimo]

I have a few projects for which I need to create moldings similar to the ones used when installing shutters onto windows. These window like structures are typically arched.

My plan is to cut the blanks (MDF or poplar) on my Shopbot and to shape those blanks using a molder which I still need to purchase. Because of limited cash I have been looking into purchasing a low end molder such a the Grizzly (Model W1812) or William & Hussey (Model 154 or 206). For the arched part I would need an “Elliptical Jig” which goes with one of those machines.

As I do not have any experience in this area I would like to ask a few questions from people in this group:
1. Does anyone have any brand/model recommendations for molders?
2. Are the knives for molders machine/brand specific? Which are the best knives brands?
3. Does one typically run the material through on a single pass or are multiple passes necessary?
4. How well do the elliptical jigs work?
5. What is the best technique for joining molding parts lengthwise? Finger Joints?

Thank you

[cabnet636]

i have the wh moulder, lots of companys make knives for it and the bolt pattern is wh specific, i am not sure but i belive the "shopfox" and wh are interchangable.

jim

[Gary Campbell]

Thomas...
1) The WH is the best, ShopFox & Grizzley are clones and equal to each other but slightly less quality in the castings than the WH. They appear to cut nearly the same.

2) Yes, when you order you must tell the maker the hole spacing on the arbor. I have most of mine custom made.

3) We have done all of ours single pass, which includes a pretty robust bar edge.

4) I have never used a purchased jig, as there are many online sources for a DIY. I did that and it worked well, untill I tried to go under 12" radius

5) MDF... butt joint and glue..maybe a biscuit. Poplar... finger joint 1st choice, biscuit second choice. Make sure you join all pieces before you run thru the molder if possible.

Send an email to islaww(at)comcast.net I have more info on this.
Gary

[loriny]

I have had sucess joining material with a butt joint. To glue it I make the parts wide enough to use pocket holes outside of the molding. Before I cut on the Bot I remove the pocket screws, plane it flat. I use a Woodmaster 18" and am happy with it. When ever I cut I just quickly cut from scrap mdf my tightest radius on the inside of the curve, and put a straight fence on the outside. For curved work ensure that your knives are open ended(no leg on the inside) If It is paint grade I just cut from light weight MDF.
Lorin

[david_white]

I have A Mikron moulder to do all the profiling for the moulding operation. If there was ever two tools made for each other it is the mikron and the bot. however the mikron cost more than the bot. The W&H is the tool I started with and it is a great tool. The grizzly and shop fox are cheap imported knock offs and are not even in close in quality. If you are profiling a radius you don't need the jig but if you plan to profile an elliptical shape the jig is the only way to go. The W&H jig is well thought out and works great.I tried to make my own jig and it never worked out. As far as the knives go there are two varieties corrugated back and the W&H style witch will fit the grizzly and shop fox type moulders. If you are going to paint finger joint is great. If you are going to stain but joint with a biscuit is the way to go. Mdf will take the edge off M2 steel in no time better to go with black nitride tipped steel for mdf.

[cabnet636]

a mikron is a fine piece of equipment!!

jim

[wberminio]

Diddo with Gary,David and Lorin

I've had W&H for awhile /upgrade to their newer controls.
Great machine.Simple does the job.
Butt joints with biscuits works very well.
“Elliptical Jig” works very well-no need to make a special jig for curves-
Cut your template on the bot/attach material and feed it through.
I use Trupan for paint grade-with no issues with blade wear.MDF is too abrasive for HSS knives.
I usually get custom knives cut.
Tell them what machine you have and they will figure it out.

The Bot and the W&H make curved moulding fun again!

Erminio

[tvonschimo]

Thank all of you for your answers. This is a wonderful group.
Here are some follow up questions:

If a jig is not required for simple curved pieces (non elliptical) what is the procedure for cutting those curved pieces? How does one make sure the piece feeds properly through the machine?

W&H has two models, one with a feeder motor (Model 206) and one without (Model 154). How valuable is it or how well does the feeder mechanism work?

The consensus being that the W&H machine is the best but considering that there is close to $1600 price difference between W&H and Grizzly (comparing GrizzlyW1812 and W&H 206 as both feature a variable speed feeder mechanism), would you in any circumstances consider buying the Grizzly?

Is the difference between W&H and Grizzly in:
a.

[blackhawk]

Thomas - Have you considered the Woodmaster? It is the only planer/moulder that I have ever used, so I can't compare it to the others. I have used it several times for moulding and it has done a good job. It is American made and is pretty versatile. You can plane, mould, drum sand, and gang rip with it. They also sell a curved moulding jig for it. They also come standard with a variable speed feeder.

[frank134]

I have a woodmaster. I love it. I had the wh. It a good machine but for the same I got the woodmaster were I could run two blade at one time. I can do the back then the front. It also does elliptical and you can do floor in one pass with the help of two router mount to the back. I brought the woodmaster because at the time my wh did not have the var speed. You can get blade for a lot less for the woodmaster. go to their web site and look.One thing I only us it for molding never try the saw or sander. I have the 18" unit.

[loriny]

I use the woodmaster for all my planing and molding. I thickness sand a bit with it but it is certainly not the best for this. I haven't had a lot of luck gang ripping, but it does a fair job at it. If you plan to gang rip I would recommend knives with legs on both ends as the saw marks will clean up with them. As for curved stuff I think it is an excellant piece of equipment.

[tvonschimo]

I looked at the Woodmaster website based on the recommendations. It certainly looks like a nice piece of equipment. The curved molding jig also seems well designed, and the pricing is not too bad. I could not find any information about the minimum radius on curved moldings. It seems to me that the W&H may be able to handle smaller radius as it has an "open front" design. Does anyone know what the minimum radius for the Woodmaster would be?

Still curious though, has anyone had hands on experience (good, bad, horrific…) with the ShopFox 1812 and could perhaps share the results of his/her experience. Of course, I would love to buy the best of the best but sometimes “good enough” may have to do because of money constraints. But like anything else the cheaper option may not even reach the “good enough” status and in that case just be a waste of money. So, "Good Enough" or "Piece of Junk"?

I am in the process of adopting a child from Taiwan and probably because of that I am losing my bias about "made in Taiwan"


Thank you again.

TVS


Thank you again.

TVS

[david_white]

The proses for running a radius on the W&H type machine is to cut an inside and outside radius out of scrap and clamp it to the bed of the machine.The blank then rides in between the two guides.In my opinion the W&H will give a better quality of cut (less chatter)and will probably last longer but I think that depends no how hard you use it.