Best heater for shop

[magic]

I'm finally going to break down and get a heater. The shop has vents in the roof. I realize I will only get warm by standing in front of the burner.

Do those propane powered heaters, that attach directly to the tank work better then the separate units that are tubes?

[thewoodcrafter]

The tank mounted heaters are infrared. They don't heat the air, they only heat anything in front of it.
The tube or torpedo heaters are the way to heat a space. But mine will suck down a big tank in about 4 days.

[ken_rychlik]

They make a new style that is about 6 feet tall, has a bonnet on top and heats an area very well. It comes at a price though, because a 20 pound bottle will only last one day. A friend of mine has two of them he uses for parties. They have them at the Depot.

I have had the tube heaters in kerosine, and they work good, but will drive you out of the shop with fumes and they are loud.

Mostly I burn scrap wood in a ben franklin wood stove, but I use one of the over the bottle ones to get me along till the wood heater catches up. The good thing about the over the bottle unit, is I can throw it in a cabinet during the summer and it's not in the way.

With burning wood you have to be carefull of fires, but a little common sense goes a long way.


Kenneth

[myxpykalix]

My shop is 16x24 fairly small and i have a Reddyheater that is on wheels it looks like the back of a F-15 fighter jet and even on the coldest days with no insulation in the walls i am working in there in a T shirt at 55 degrees in about 5-6 minutes. It has a thermostat and uses different fuel types. I like mine, i paid about $200.00 at Big Lots for mine and it was over $400.00 at Lowes for same one. It isn't any louder then most other tools you use in the shop.

8912

[coach]

I had a heater that ran on a propane tank in my 24 x 24 2 story garage / shop in New Hampshire. I turned it on in the morning and ran back in the house for an hour. I was turning it down in a couple hours. I was really happy with it. I had it on a 100 gal propane tank.

[gc3]

...well it never gets below 45 here, we keep the shop windows open 90% of the year. I might finally install an AC unit in the bot room this summer...

Happy New Year, Feliz Ano Nuevo!


Gene Crain
www.plantasymaderas.com (http://www.plantasymaderas.com)
8913

[magic]

Jack

My shop, not including the office is 100 x 20 would the same heater you're using work for me? keep in mind that I have 6 vents in the ceiling. (which I should make doors for).

Thanks

[bleeth]

Magic: Get a steel drum and a furnace door for it. Line the bottom with fire bricks. Run the exhaust tube up through the roof or up and out the wall. Save your scrap all summer and burn it in the winter. A 20" box fan hung above it will blow the warm air through your shop. Kept a shop in Seattle with similar square footage so warm you could be down to a t-shirt in 20 minutes.

Gas firing puts out a lot of moisture as well as being a bit chancy when heavy dust is in the air. Besides, why pay to dump your scrap when you can use it?

[dlcw]

When I was in Ohio I used a wall mounted ventless propane heater. You can get these with or without a fan to blow warm out. I set up a 100 gallon propane tank outside and ran black pipe into the shop. The tank would last most of the winter. The shop was about 3500 sq.ft and insulated and the heater would keep the shop at about 65 degrees without working up a sweat. With this model you don't have to worry about putting in a vent and it won't cause you to pass out from carbon monoxide poisoning. I got it through Northern Tools.

In my current shop (3200 sq ft) I have radiant floor heating and it keeps it toasty warm, even when it's 15 below zero outside. Also, it doesn't blow any dust around.

Don
www.dlwoodworks.com (http://www.dlwoodworks.com)

[erniek]

I have a wall mounted ventless natural gas heater. I think it's 30,000 BTU heating 1200 sq ft. Works well but takes a while to get it up to temp. Also puts out a lot of moisture. I usually run a de-humdifier if I don't have the paint room fan going.

[brian]

I agree with Dave
A wood heater with a fan works great for my 1200 sq.ft.
I save enough scraps to get me through about half the winter.Mind you It doesn't get as cold in British Columbia as in some area's.

[wberminio]

I used to have a wood stove with fan attached to ductwork to direct the heat.Worked well/but spent
alot of time feeding and stoking the fire.The ventless propane also
works-but since it burns extremely efficiently-it will smell the shop when using certain finishes.
I now have an oil/AC combo.
-BTW Don't burn Melamine-You might get a call from your neighbor complaining about the heavy black smoke!

Erminio

[nailzscott]

A word of caution on a wood burner. My shop already had a vent stack for a wood burner when I bought the place. State Farm said they would not insure my shop or garage if I was heating with a wood burner. I put a wood burner in the house & they are OK with that, just not the shop. Seems wrong but they get to make up the rules. I have a propane furnace in the shop too, but most of the time I just point a propane torpedo heater in my direction if I need a little heat.

[myxpykalix]

I have alway thought that you want some type of heat source that you can cut off and leave immediately.
With any kind of wood burning stove just the act of stoking the fire stirring up flying ashes that float up and land in your sawdust pile is scary to me. Then i wouldn't want to leave burning embers in a stove.

With the reddy heater it blows the heat out and with a shop that big it would take longer to heat then my shop but when you turn it off there is no danger of any hot embers and it is controllable.

I definitely would make some type of covers for your vents otherwise the heat will just go "thru the roof".

If you don't use the whole shop when you work you may want to put up some temporary plastic sheeting to segregate the place where you do work.

[eaglesplsh]

We use a large torpedo heater in our small shop. It heats well, but as others have already mentioned, the fumes are annoying and I worry about health risks that I might not be aware of.

In past winters I've burned diesel, as I couldn't find kerosene at local gas stations. Just found out that it's available at hardware stores in 5 gal drums, so I'm switching over next week. Kerosene costs 2x as much, but it's suppose to burn a lot cleaner.

I keep a smoke detector / CO2 detector and large fire extinguisher nearby just in case. I don't spray paint or aerosol glues while the heater's on. I've never had the CO2 detector go off from the fumes, but with the diesel my clothes stink at the end of the day. When we first started using the heater I was afraid of condensation/rusty tools. It hasn't turned out to be a problem. I open up the doors and air everything out a couple times per day.

Our heater has a thermostat built in for auto on/off. The thermostat triggered constant short bursts of heat, trying to keep room temp steady. I found that most of the fumes are produces at start up when the burner is no at full temp. Now I turn it on/off manually, letting it run for longer periods of time and letting the shop temp swing between 45-55.

The best/cheapest/cleanest/no-hassle heat solution I've found is insulated work overalls, a down jacket, and wool hat with ear flaps. (If you've never tried one because they look silly, trust me - the ear flaps are key!) The warm clothes cut our heating season down by about 2 months/year.

If you're planning on staying in your shop long term I'd invest in insulation and a better heating solution. For our temporary digs it's been affordable.

[bcondon]

I just added another loop to my force hot water heater, 20 feet of baseboard and a separate thermostat. The burner is a gas 93% efficient heater and attached with PEX tubing going through the garage and into the back room in the garage. When I built the room, we used 2x6 and added insulation and plastic.

The pex was a real pain to work with becase when it is cold, it is hard to bend but will bleed the line of air over the weekend and then will have a place to hide.

I used the Reddy Heaters (35K-55KBTU) propane but the jet noise and the propane smell finally got to me to invest in the $350 for the extra loop on the boiler. I had an extra pump, manifold and place on the conrol box for the termostat connection...

[burchbot]

I know of one guy that set a forced air wood burning furnace 2 feet from his shop. Ran a two ducts, hot and cold into the shop and single wall stove pipe for the chimney.. I’m sure there had to be some lose of heat the way it was set up but it worked well There is in idea here that a person could build on.
Dan

[navigator7]

The turbo heaters or Salamanders (as we call 'em) like Jack talks about, consumes the same oxygen as the user.
Where I've seen problems with these is in large areas with little ventilation. Workers get owly, slow down, headaches, get stupid, cranky and grumpy as the carbon monoxide content rises. In smaller areas, the heat just drives a person to turn off the heat.
Just thought that I should be pointed out for those of us educated in public schools.

I own two for starting heavy equipment when no man nor beast should be outside.

If a guy is thinking about pouring a concrete floor and using a propane or diesel fired burner to keep the concrete from freezing .... forget it! The exhaust gases from combustion chemically combine with the hydrating concrete creating a reaction called "carbonization of concrete".
Your final product will be a concrete slab that is forever dusty, and very weak on the surface. It may pop off in areas. It will soon spall or crush under point loading like that found on steel wheels and such. Car tires and foot prints will constantly wick up concrete dust. Propane and diesel fired heaters ruin more slabs poured in cold areas than rock salt.
A "heat exchanger" is the proper tool for heating curing concrete or heating coils like a Thawzall machine.

Don has described what to me is the holy grail of shop heating: "In my current shop (3200 sq ft) I have radiant floor heating and it keeps it toasty warm, even when it's 15 below zero outside. Also, it doesn't blow any dust around. "
The only thing I'd add is a ceiling fan.

For creature comforts in the absence of a heated floor, I like the parabolic electrical heaters or the propane fired infrared heaters.

I've inverted an electrical parabolic heater and aimed it at the floor near where I am working....the concrete gets warms and it seems like an efficient use of heat energy even though I'm not using the device as the safety engineers intended.

An experience I had placing concrete in the mountains made me a believer in infrared heat.
A customer oddly left an infrared light (heat lamp) aimed on in his dirt floor shop 24/7. It was 500 or 1000 watt. Not much.
We poured about 48 yards. The area where the heat lamp contacted the soil was near the end of the pour. The area covered was about 8x12'.
It was cold and snowy but the customer planned to keep the shop area warm with a heat exchanger.
Anyway....everybody was invited to burgers, beer and and ribs in between finishing.
The head finisher kept checking the slab hoping to get on the concrete sooner than later.
During one of his checks, we heard the man scream like a girl!
We all go rushing to see what was the matter.
At the wettest end of the pour, a very pretty rectangle magically appeared upon the surface of the wet concrete. This represented the range of the infrared heater. The an 8 x 12 area of concrete was ready to finish but the slab wasn't!! This is a horrific event to a finisher hoping to get a burnt glass smooth finish.

In the end, it all worked out but using a heat lamp, infrared or parabolic heater to heat the concrete makes a lot of sense to me.

The down side to any open flame, like a parabolic of propane infrared is dust.
Boom

[erik_f]

I am using a 30000btu ventless wall hung natural gas heater I won on ebay for $75. I realize it puts off a good amount of moisture, but I'm not trying to get my shop to 75 degrees, just not ball shriveling cold. 9 degrees really sucks to work in. I decided to spend the money on insulating my little one car garage work space than spend big bucks on a massive heater. My heater isn't thermostat controlled, so I get it warmed up and then shut it off. I've tried heating an uninsulated garage before...better off spending the time insulating. I'm careful with the ventless and usually leave a window cracked to get some fresh air in.

[gundog]

I have been heating my shop with one of the diesel jet engine type it is loud and really messes with my sinuses. I am getting ready to put in a NG heater that hangs from the ceiling. I am going with a 75,000 BTU model.

In a shop I had at one of my last houses it was 1200 SQ Ft and uninsulated it had a wood stove and the ceiling had vents. In the winter I would just stapple cardboard over the vents and in the summer take them off.

Mike

[magic]

Tell you what did 3 years ago, I made a wire hanger like a backpack and hung a small electric heater on it, The problem was the electrical cord I was tethered to.

I stopped using that system when people came over, gave me funny looks and kept stepping on the cord... not to mention how many times i got hung-up.... but it was fun, for a week.

I'm probably going with a propane unit because of all the millions of rules, in my city.

[g_hinton]

I use a pellet stove with built in blower heats 2200 sqft and pellets are fairly cheap vents outside with a 3" pipe and about 90% efficient

[navigator7]

Oh yeah! The pellet stove is a great way to heat a shop!
Dry heat, no fumes, easy install.
Definitely one of the best purchases I've ever made. It was a Whitfield. Still at my old house ;-(
My brother in law has a shop model, self starting and runs for 2 to 3 days on each filling. He lives in Cheney, Washington where it gets cold. Doesn't it, Don?
Don't rule out a ceiling fan or two.
Population rules out burning scrap for a lot of guys.
Too bad a guy can't make his own pellets???

[sailfl]

I can't resist adding my 2 cents. I turn on my halogen light and shine it at me when it is cold in my garage. But I live in Florida.

[bcondon]

Chuck, oh thank God you found the problem... it is the propane heater that was making me stupid...

I thought it was just me..

Happy New Year

[navigator7]

LOL, Bob....At least you have an excuse and a remedy.
My problem is congenital.

Best wishes for you too!

[mark_stief]

Chuck You can make your pellets and I do check out Make Your Own Pellets.com on their website check out the photos you will see my setup w/ bulk bin and a grinder to make the shavings all the same size to pellet I have a custom made saw dust burner for heat works just like pellet stove w/ a auger that feeds the fire with forced air for combustion I make pellets all summer and then burn my saw dust in the winter heats the shop 32x60 to 75 degrees if I want. I use about 1000 to 1500 bd.ft. of lumber a week average over the year so saw dust supply isn't a problem

[gc3]

Nice one Nils....seems like these guys are a little "frosty" to the "best heater for shop" humor.

Happy New Year, Feliz Ano Nuevo from where it never goes below 45!


Gene Crain
www.plantasymaderas.com (http://www.plantasymaderas.com)

[navigator7]

@ Mark,
Well blow me down!
(Insert Popeye's laugh)
When you get time send me a link...I can't find your machine on their website unless you own one of their machines???
Good stuff! I like it!

[myxpykalix]

Mark,
since it is on the same subject i would like to see your setup if you have any pictures. This kind of looks interesting.

[mark_stief]

Chuck & Jack
Go to their website look under Pellet Info then to Photos and I have I think 8 pictures in there w/ the grinder,bulk bins and it shows the pellet machine apart so you can see the rollers and die that press the wood into pellets I have two of them now so I should hopefully be able to get up around 500-700 lbs an hour production

[navigator7]

Ahhhh!
I found them:
http://www.makeyourownpellets.com/pellet-info/photos

8914
8915

8916
8917
8918

Mark, How much heat does the unit generate?
We have a company close by called Atlas Pellet, in Omak, Wa.
I lifted their new pellet silo about a year and a half ago.

8919
They gave me a tour of the place and I was impressed by how hot the pellet extrusion head was. Kinda hot and steamy. They had machines built during WW2 used for feed pellets, I think. Very old but it was working like a champ!
I love seeing old equipment making a buck for enterprising people!

Your reply is a really cool tidbit of information. I had no idea these tools were available for John Q Public.
Or...that you could use leave, pine needles, paper and other debris for pellet making.
What is the secret binding agent used to make the pellets premium grade?
Molasses?
Lignin?

What horsepower or torque requirements are needed?
Can I assume an electric motor would work just as well for a power source provided the proper calculations were done?
Tks

[mark_stief]

Chuck
I use the binder they sell on the web site because these are cold presses and they build their own heat the pellets come out at 160-180 degrees then you have to cool them that's what the wood box is for I have 1/4" pegboard on the bottom with a 1200cfm dust collector to blow air thru the pellets you can buy the pellet machine with electric or diesel motors or do like I do and run them from the pto of my tractor and remember if it will go thru a grinder you can make a pellet out of it there are even people making pellets out of horse bedding and with the you know what still mixed in

[navigator7]

OMG...the machines will even take "you know what"?
This has political implications.
2010 might be the Year of the Pellet!
;-)

Thanks for the info......I gotta go plow.

[rb99]

The pellets seem expensive to me...$6200 for the pellet maker, thousands for the furnace, then the install, the mulcher, the cooling fan, the binder, and all the fuel and electricity to run the stuff. Plus all the labour required to make them and feed the furnace... whew!

RIB

[eaglesplsh]

I don't know how they compare with pellet burners, but I knew a bunch of folks in Ohio that were switching to _corn_ burners. It sounded like these units worked the same way as the pellets - a hopper full of corn kernels that are fed into the firebox by a thermostat controlled electric conveyor.

Guys were thrilled because they could go to the local grain processor and buy a pickup truck full of corn real cheap.

[jimmya]

Work Hard, stay busy! No heater needed
Jimmy

[navigator7]

@ Jimmy
You have a good workaround. I draw the line when my tools freeze to my hands. ;-)
(The adult version of licking a steel flag pole)

8920

@ Richard,
The number one frustration for me about a pellet stove is its requirement for electricity to operate. When I lived in Seattle, storms bring down 1000's of trees and power and phone lines.
Being without power is one thing, being cold is another.
Trapped by our own technology!

The pellet stove I had operated on less than 124 watts of power.
I learned my pellet stove would run for a very long time on my NAPA jump start kit that also comes with an inverter. It got us through all the outages.

My business used to be pumping concrete. You haven't lived until you've tried earning a living in an area where winter temps can drop to -20ºf. (even though it is a dry cold) Either you don't work for 5 months which is the kiss of death or, you actually work during the winter and go mad from the cold, the wind and the fun that comes multiplication of problems due to frozen everything.

The idea of actually working productively through the winters inside a heated shop, watching with blatant disregard blowing, drifting snow raging past my vantage point from a cute little bay window while -60ºf wind chill that would make a Ponderosa scream is my holy grail.

Electrical power is really cheap here but something tells me that will change soon.

Self sufficiency is a hobby and a goal.

[gc3]

Solar with genset backup. We are our own power company.

Move to a more temperature stable environment, easier on your bones.

www.outbackpower.com (http://www.outbackpower.com)

Gene Crain
www.plantasymaderas.com (http://www.plantasymaderas.com)